How an Online University Stays Human in an AI World

[0:16]  Welcome back to the heart and hustle podcast. We've got Mr. Raghu in the building. How you doing, sir?

[0:19]  Good good to see you

[0:21]  I say, man, exciting. It is for those that are watching or listening, it is a weekend for us. I can imagine there's even more excitement as we start to prepare ourselves for that weekend. What is the thing that you're going to be doing, man, to kind of turn it off if you're turning it off?

[0:34]  I don't know if you can ever turn it off right now that weekends are great. I live in the West Coast We everything's outdoor right and you go biking go hiking I just got to figure out which of those I'm gonna do this weekend But you know like anything else there's always stuff around the house that has to get done So I got to figure this whole thing out

[0:53]  You know, you saying that I had started my floors because I was looking at the prices on flooring, realize, you know what? I'm going to do these floors myself. Now, I didn't realize that I'm not as young anymore and my body was going to my body hurts a little different. OK, so I had finished the floor for the most part. I had probably like 20 percent left, but it's like the corners, the hallways. So I kind of saved that a little bit. And. Man. what I thought was going to take two hours took like four hours and I was hurt. OK, but I get you on that. There's always something to do at the house. Right. Always. It did. It did.

[1:28]  Yeah, I'm sure it came out wonderful so doesn't matter how long it takes at the end of day It's all like what you see is what matters

[1:35]  I was proud of myself. I'm not gonna lie. I've never done this a day in my life, but it's a cool thing that you can do now when you have something like AI or YouTube. YouTube University will teach you whatever it is you need to know.

[1:46]  You can learn a lot by seeing it, that's true. Like you know, if you got something like you said, something in your house needs to be fixed, you can get a, there's so many videos out there right now. But they still need experts. I still find that the experts are so much better than me. And they have so many tricks

[2:02]  Hahaha!

[2:02]  that they don't teach you on YouTube by themselves. You have to go and talk to an expert actually. So I try to do what I can, but I often have to bring in lot of help to make sure it's done right.

[2:13]  I love it man. And you're in Phoenix, right?

[2:16]  No, I live in San Francisco. I'm all the way the coast.

[2:17]  San Francisco. God, I got a born and raised.

[2:24]  I was actually in India, moved here when I was one, have lived many places in the country. I was initially in Dayton, Ohio, then grew up in Pittsburgh and I probably lived in like most of the major cities in this country since then. So, but I

[2:39]  God

[2:39]  think San Francisco my home now.

[2:40]  Is this the one that you've enjoyed the most?

[2:42]  You know, it's hard to say the most. I, you know, it's just like at each stage of your life, you see different things and you enjoy what you at each moment. what you find. I mean, I enjoyed growing up in Pittsburgh. had great rolling hills and deer in the backyard and I was riding my bike wherever I wanted. That was a lot of fun. I can't see myself doing that now. But I think every place

[3:04]  Yeah

[3:04]  that sells some special parts, you just have to find them and take advantage of them.

[3:08]  Love it. for those that are watching and listening, what is your title? What's the organization you represent today?

[3:14]  Yeah, so I'm the Chief Operating Officer at the University of Phoenix. I tell people what I do is, know, people always ask, what do you mean? What does that mean? And I tell them, look, my responsibility is to make sure others are successful. Our students and those employers that we work with, I got to find ways to make sure they can achieve their goals.

[3:33]  So the University of Phoenix,

[3:34]  you

[3:34]  is in Phoenix.

[3:38]  It is a national university. We're online. We're headquartered in Phoenix, but we serve students all around the country. And

[3:48]  Got it.

[3:49]  we have staff living all around the country to do that. Like I live in the West Coast. I don't live in Phoenix. I go to Phoenix occasionally, but I live out here. And we have people working and going to school and teaching from everywhere.

[4:02]  Got it. I think I may have passed the headquarters. Is it closer to Arizona?

[4:07]  It's very close to the airport. probably saw when you're going through Phoenix, you can see a big sign

[4:13]  Okay.

[4:13]  and a big building. That's our headquarters.

[4:15]  I did. I did, man. And this is when I knew that we were going to have this podcast. I remember like, crap, look, it's right here. I was downtown.

[4:22]  Yeah, perfect.

[4:23]  I was heading downtown actually to the Children's Museum. I think it's where we're going. And I

[4:28]  Okay, yeah.

[4:29]  ended up passing by and I thought like, wow. I've seen it all the time. I tell you what you guys do. And maybe this is just advertisement since the last time I spoke, but I was getting all these ads and I was like, my God. So it's just, it's one of those things that you see all the time. And I did realize that it was a on a lot of I guess you guys do mostly online. Is that correct? Like is that virtual?

[4:47]  We're mainly online, that's right.

[4:50]  Okay, so I think I worked. Now, I know I worked there, but I worked for JetBlue at one point for the airline industry. And when we were doing they were like paying for some some classes that you guys were one of those classes to do virtual on. It was like you guys and some other ones. So how long have you guys kind of been in business? Like what does that actually look like from the aerial view?

[5:10]  Yeah, so university started 50 years ago. This is our 50th year anniversary this year. We were the first to actually go and develop online. If you look at the university, our whole purpose is to help people who can't be helped in the traditional education system. So those are people who are like yourself, working adults, right? You got kids, you got family responsibilities, you got personal responsibilities, you got community responsibilities. We help those people continue to advance, whether they're looking to advance in their career or just advance their learning, while they can, when they can. And we built ourselves purely upon that. So yeah, it's exciting. We have over a million alumni now. And we continue to find new ways to help people grow. So it's an exciting place to be.

[5:57]  when you talked about a million, you know, alumni's and can only imagine that you have more thousands that are just in the program. How do you guys stay connected? Like in a space like today where communication has kind of changed and it's, you know, it's no longer just sending a postcard to somebody's house or email. Now we really got to meet people where they're at, whether it's social, whether it's, you know, SMS, maybe utilizing a little AI. Where do you guys kind of sit with all that?

[6:23]  Yeah, I mean, I think you got to say that's great point and great question, right? This is still you get all about the people right and end the day

[6:29]  Mm-hmm.

[6:29]  you learn as much from others as you do from just reading and seeing seeing a video. Probably you can learn more. I find from others as well. So we built ourselves so that people can interact on an ongoing basis. We've got faculty who are worked very closely with our students in their classes. We've got alumni networks. that go and interact with each other after people graduate. We have student meetups that happen occasionally also between the individuals. So there's a lot of ways in which we try to make sure that the human connection is there no matter what happens. Because I've always found that the human connection is always more important and the technologies should be there to help that human connection really come to life.

[7:10]  You actually had a post I was looking at on your LinkedIn. And it talks about the future of higher education will be defined by one question. Can institutions adapt as quickly as a workforce at preparing students to enter? What is your thoughts on that? For those that may not see

[7:35]  That is, think.

[7:35]  that.

[7:35]  Yeah, I mean, you've been reading a lot of this. You know a lot about this space and so forth. Everyone's

[7:35]  Mm-hmm.

[7:35]  talking about the fact that education is really expensive. They're talking about and they're wondering, is it worth the investment and the time, the dollars, the time, the mind share to go and do this? Or am I going to get the value I want from the end of the day? And I think those are all fair questions, right? We should all be asking those questions. I asked that when I was going back to grad school, is it really gonna be worth it for me now spent another

[7:57]  Mm-hmm.

[7:57]  two years after I spent five years already in school to go on and go on forward. And it's a question we should all be asking. What's happening now though is that it's just, and you're seeing, and you mentioned AI is completely shifting the pace at which change is happening. Every new technology has done that. Think about the cell phones when it first came out. Right? People are at least to think of phones as something you just hold up to talk to somebody. Now your cell phone is effectively the way you interact with your life, right? You do your Facebook on it. Let's say you do all your messaging, your friends upon it. Sometimes you talk to them. I prefer talking to them, but some people just text them, right? Everything's happening through that. That created a lot of change. Like the internet created a lot of change. There were jobs that exist now that never existed, right? You could not be an influencer in those days very easily. Today, all of us can, in some manner. So AI is just the kind of next phase of that, but it's happening fast. Like three years ago, people were just talking about it. Now it's like a household name.

[9:02]  Yeah. And then my co-host Keaton always says, we're actually at the worst that AI will ever be. Right. Because it's only going to get better from here. And it is so true. We're just at the beginning stages of it. And how do we utilize it, as you mentioned, not to replace people, but ideally help us do the repetitive tasks, those things that really could be utilized or given to AI, because that human to human interaction would never go away. This right here, just imagine me talking to AI. It wouldn't be as fun. It wouldn't be as, you know, cool, man, to speak to that human. So I do love AI. I'm definitely a user and do see that there's a lot of changes in it, man. One of the biggest changes I've seen, because it's also disrupting markets.

[9:43]  That's right. Yeah.

[9:44]  Chegg, you know, chegg.com. I've just seen how much money they've lost because of AI, because students were going to Chegg to find some answers or whatever that may have looked like. I'm not really sure. But now they've lost millions, almost 40 % just drop in profit because of something like AI. What are your thoughts on that?

[10:06]  Yeah, like I said, new technology, have to adapt to it and everyone's got to adapt to it, Look, we've been using AI for years. We use it primarily to help find ways to help people succeed. Like if someone's struggling in class, we try to use the technology to help identify what the problem is. And then we go reach out to them to help them figure out solutions for it. It's a great way to mix the human and the technology together around it. Because we can do this effectively almost in real time. We see some signals that come up, and then we can figure out an answer, and we can have a conversation with them and work with them to go solve for it. I think every organization is going to have to adapt. to AI, but I think those that are going to be successful are those who realize that we have to do things that supplement what AI can do, not just replicate what AI can do. AI

[10:56]  Mm.

[10:56]  has got a lot of great advantages, but it's also got things that just don't work. And that don't work is always going to be there. No matter how advanced it gets, there's always things that aren't going to be, I would say, in the way we think about it as right. So I've always been a firm believer that We should use technology to help drive human potential, not replace it.

[11:17]  So what do you say to those people that are, mean, you kind of added to that, but there's so many leaders in this

[11:24]  you

[11:24]  space that are scared. I work closely with in high school and one of the things they blocked it out of the high school reason being they're not educated around it. They're afraid of it. But to me, I think it's a disservice for the next generation of individuals

[11:37]  Yeah.

[11:37]  that are already utilizing this at home. What do you say to your colleagues in the space of education that may still be afraid of it?

[11:45]  Yeah, no, I think you have to embrace what's coming. I mean, it's easy to worry about what he could do wrong, right? I think we spent a lot of time worrying about what things could do wrong. I think we all need to start thinking about what it can do right, right? And

[11:59]  Mm.

[12:00]  really focus on those aspects of it. You always have people who are glass half empty, glass half full, right? I tend to lean towards a more than half full approach on it. I've seen change happen for the last, in my entire career, right? I've been in everything from technology to financial services to, to like, you know, banking and now into, you know, education. And this is one of the most fun and exciting places to be. got, you know, if I could share some of that, I could love to tell you sort of that storyline around at some point. But I've always seen that no matter what risks are there that people perceive, the benefits and the upsides are so much greater. And as you focus on that and make sure you understand the risks, but you focus on what you can achieve, you're going to be successful and you're going to help others be successful around it. So those people who are afraid of it, I think it's okay to be afraid, but I say, just go, just go play with it. Try it, see it, right? I mean, it's easy. just, right now you can even talk to your, voice to the, the, to the AI and it responds

[13:00]  Yeah.

[13:00]  and you can just, you can say, this is kind of neat. I think I could use this piece of it. Or you might say this part. Yeah, this is the part I don't like. I got to make sure that. others understand this is not good for them and, you know, and help them figure out what is good for them around it. And as educators that we have a responsibility to do that. That is our job, right? I

[13:19]  Mm-hmm.

[13:20]  grew up in a household of two parents who are both educators. One worked community college and one worked at a public research university. So I've seen and I've heard since I was like literally like five, what educators can do and how much power they have to actually help people. be successful and overcome their own fears and actually help their colleagues and their others who are involved in that overcome their fear. So I always encourage people just go, just go try it. Like what do you got to lose? It's free, it's there in front of you and it's actually, that's also a great conversation to start with your friends.

[13:56]  Yeah, no, I love it. love that you say that it is there. Utilize it. It's free. When people really start to tap into it, it's almost a game changer. And I've seen it happen where someone's like, no, no, no, no, I'm so against it. And they use it. And I was like, my God, I can't stop using this. All right. Like somebody become addicting at some point. So definitely utilize it at your

[14:13]  Yeah, right.

[14:14]  advantage of whatever it may look like for you. But you mentioned something you talked about how you went through all these different sectors. You end up in an education just like your parents. Is that how you got an education? came back to education, you wanted to kind of keep that legacy alive or how do you get financial and all these other sectors to get now into higher education?

[14:34]  Yeah, can tell you I would never thought I'd be in this space because I was growing up I was like I'm never gonna do it my parents do right I was one of those type of kids For that was I'm glad my kids aren't like that. Although maybe they are, you'll see it in your own kids

[14:46]  We don't know yet. We don't know.

[14:50]  as they grow bigger. So, no, I, you know, what I found is no matter, I've always gone to places where I find fun, interesting, I can learn and I can actually do something meaningful, right, around it. And so I never actually planned any of my steps. And in some ways, I'm almost like a poster child for what is happening now in the world is people are gonna have multiple careers. And they're going to follow their interests and their passions. They're also going to follow where they think they can actually make a meaningful impact. And I think for me, as I was kind of looking around, as things were changing, this is a space that I only learned about around, because I grew up in a traditional education system. I went to

[15:34]  Mm-hmm.

[15:34]  high school, I went to college, I went to graduate school. I thought everyone did that. I was clearly wrong around that piece of it. And as more as I got involved and started seeing this, I really became, I guess, know, infatuated in many ways about how this is a really way you can make some real meaningful impact that has not only in near term, but long term generational change. And for me, that's exciting. And what's also exciting is that this is an industry and it is an industry which people don't always realize that is that is undergoing significant change. And you have the opportunity here at Phoenix and why I joined is that you are the opportunity to really think about how best to help people in this next new world that's coming up. Before it was just data, technology, and internet, which is where online everything else came in. Now it's AI. And the power that we have to actually help people become more successful is really exciting part behind it.

[16:36]  What did you learn coming into this sector? I mean, you take in all this knowledge. What are you learning now being here?

[16:45]  Yeah, one thing I've learned is that whatever you've learned before is applicable to whatever you do next. Right. That's kind of one thing, which was always a surprise because people think about one industry is so different from another and there are differences. But what you bring to it to one can easily be transported into another. So that was one big learning I had around it. The second one is that you never and became quite obvious you never stop learning. I think I think we fully appreciate that everything that we do, everyone that we speak with, we're actually learning along it. And if you can give back at the same time you're learning, you're going to be even more successful than if you just learn and just keep it for yourself. So those are kind of three things I've learned around is like you can never stop. You should never stop. You should always be curious. And really, whatever you learn, it's going to be important for you forever. So don't don't ever stop it.

[17:39]  Do you also feel you were able to learn? We talked about a little before that you had kids, I think one graduated already college, one's in college. Did you learn from that experience of just going to visit and just kind of being a part of that journey for them? Is there something that you learned there

[17:52]  Here's something that

[17:53]  you were able to also kind of input to your role today?

[17:57]  I think you learn everything from your kids every day. just again, so one of the things you don't realize, but you are, you're picking up. It's more than the lingo around it. You're right. You definitely pick up a lot more around it. You know, it's, it's interesting to see them and what they're doing and sort of reflect on your own experiences at that point in time and realize how little you knew and you could, and then realize and look back and then look forward and say, despite how little I knew. I still figure out a way to get there. Right. I think what I've, what I've learned is that you gotta just let these, let the kids do the same thing because they likely, they are better. they have better understanding of the way things are today than I will ever have. Cause they're living it today. Right. They're living the change or they're like, they're in the moment. Like, you know, the other day, my, my daughter is talking, we're talking about robotics. She's in the robots.

[18:52]  Mm-hmm.

[18:53]  She's been in just like three years old. Right. you know, I told her, look at this neat thing I found these robots can do now. And she kind of laughs at me and goes, yeah, that was done five years ago. Right. So

[19:05]  my god.

[19:05]  it's like, you know, you're, hearing from them that what is really possible. It just kind of blows your mind. It's like, okay, I'm need to really kind of keep up on it. So I say, learn everything from them every single day, right? Like, how do you, you know, how do you like do things around? Like I would never done before. Like I know people always talk about, you know, how to use my cell phone. Right now. I think of myself as pretty adept at my cell phone, but can tell you, the other day my daughter's like, I was trying to figure out something simple, like how do I make sure the screen automatically changes brightness, right? She goes here, she did in two seconds. And I was like, okay, I could have done that. So that's something simple, but I think what I learned most from them is to always be there when they need it. and to learn sort of what they need at that moment is going to constantly change. And the way they show that to me is going to constantly change. So for me, I find that the most fun because it is not fixed in stone. And it keeps you sharp and keeps life interesting.

[20:13]  You mentioned this role is fun. It is, I could only imagine, rewarding. What are some of the unique things that you guys provide as an institution?

[20:24]  So the university itself provides quite a bit, right? Our mission, our goals have always been around how do I help people meet their objectives? And the vast majority of our students are here to advance their careers and improve their lives. We've built all this technology so we can make that transition and that knowledge between learning and the workplace become much more understood. An example of that is we have career tools that people can use to say, here's what I know already, here's what I'm learning, what are the jobs I could be going after, and what do I need to be successful within those jobs? We give them career counselors to help them do that as well, to help sort of guide them and talk to them around it. Because again, technology is not the answer by itself. You still need the human part to understand that. We built, like I mentioned earlier, tools to help them identify where they may be struggling. and then find ways to help them overcome that struggle, whether it's academic struggle or a life challenge, we help them find ways to kind of get over that within that. We've built all our curriculum and all our teaching to help ensure that we maximize the time the students have to learn and that so they can spend that time on learning. So we try to eliminate all the other kind of administrative stuff that people have to do to be in school and make as little as possible. We've also found ways to make learning very affordable for them. We're one of the most affordable universities in the country and we keep finding ways to do that. We have many situations where our company is actually paying the full tuition for their for their own employees to come to school with us. We try to find answers like that also so that the burden isn't isn't on the individual. They can again spend their time learning on it. So there's not one component. It's the entire university's built around how do I help others be successful and we've looked at all aspects and we continue to evolve and change those aspects to find new and better ways.

[22:19]  So this is completely online, right? Is that correct?

[22:24]  we are almost 100 % online. A few students still come to one of our campuses in Phoenix, but everybody else is online.

[22:30]  that's cool. And then you guys pretty much offer everything that you guys will find at your traditional university, as in classes.

[22:36]  We don't have a sports team, I can tell you that. That's one thing you're not going to find. And you're not going to find some, you know, lot of buildings with ivy on them. We don't have that. We spend our money on making sure on the teaching and learning and support for our students. And that's what we spend our money on.

[22:52]  And it's probably what makes you guys even more affordable than the others is because you don't have that budget to take care of all these extracurricular activities. Is that correct?

[23:03]  It's like I said, we want to make sure that whatever we do is 100 % focused on helping others succeed. a building doesn't do that, right?

[23:12]  Mm-hmm.

[23:12]  And a sports team doesn't do that. But solid teaching, curriculum that's focused on the workplace, students who are getting support whenever they need it, those are things that matter. And we'll

[23:28]  Mm-hmm.

[23:28]  always continue to invest in those things that matter. I think we always ask our students, like, how do you feel? you feel like the learning is valuable? Do you feel like you're getting support you need? Do you feel like this is someplace that you'd want others, you know, talk to others about? And overwhelmingly, we have positive responses from our students that they've learned. What they're learning here is very effective in the workplace and that they love the support and that they get. In fact, at graduations, and I wish you could come to one of our graduations, the one thing that students always talk about, is to support the advisors I've given them from the start about should I come here all the way through to the graduate. They talk about their advisors and their faculty. And that's two things they mentioned about the place. And to me, that's all that matters.

[24:16]  I mean, what I find fascinating is the and you say over and over is we really communicate. We really are tapped in to the everyday experience of these individuals.

[24:30]  a feeling.

[24:31]  Like, is that a big focus for you guys? Just a communication piece, making sure that no one is falling through the cracks.

[24:38]  Yeah, we did. I'd say it's fun not falling to the cracks is I'd say the main main point, right? We don't want anyone not to succeed and will bend over backwards and we do to help find ways to do it. Everyone's different, right? And

[24:52]  Mm-hmm.

[24:53]  I think the one thing we all try to do and get better at and it's always a challenge is how do you meet the person where they need it when they need it and how they need it? And how do you really know? what's going to help them be, you know, to get over any hurdle they're facing and move on

[25:06]  Mm-hmm.

[25:06]  and overcome that challenge and move on and continue to do it. And I just find that, first of all, our students are just incredibly motivated. They've got really high levels of grit. They do not give up. And so I think that's challenging us to make sure that we can make sure that we don't give up ever either around it. And, you we do everything we can to make sure that doesn't happen.

[25:28]  What do you find is the best form of communication nowadays? mean, as the generations change, is it that SMS or are we emailing? How do you feel people get the ability to communicate with us at its best?

[25:40]  Yeah, know everyone's different, right? So I think you learn over time. This is where your AI and your analytics really help, because you'll find out over time what works best for that individual student and when. Like you may find out that the best time, the best way that someone wants to interact with you is a text message at 10 o'clock in the morning. It's like, OK, I got to make sure I have, you know, I can respond to that and do it quickly. Or it might be at, you know. 11 p.m. because the kids already went to bed and they're out talking on it. I got to make sure I have either technology or people available to answer a question for like something as simple about about you know like my computer is not not finding that you know not turning on properly to like I'm struggling with this one concept how do I get over it. So those these are types of things that we think about is how do you help help them you know overcome that. So these are all the things we built these are all things we have and we continue to evolve it right. I wish I could find a way that said everyone can use the text, it simplifies it, but I can tell you I don't use this text and I can't imagine anyone else just uses text either, so.

[26:43]  Yeah, now I love that you even think about tech, because some organizations have even got that far to text. that is truly you mentioned about the operational hours of nine to five, someone's working. What happened at 11 o'clock after they put their kids to bed? And now I got questions. Do we still have people available? And as we talked about AI and the technology, the ability to have a conversation through text message that allows us to get from point A to point B is phenomenal. But I don't know that a lot of higher eds are in that space.

[26:55]  Right. I think we still have people available. And we talked about AI, this technology, the business needs to have a conversation. Through text messages that allow us to get from point A to point B, it's phenomenal. I don't know that a lot of higher eds are in that space. It's like you guys are really just in the age of 100, or that they're sort of out-pacific of the place where those people are supposed to be able to build, but you guys are just there to build. That would be why today we're trying to look behind on this whole space.

[27:11]  Seems like you guys are really just way beyond where some organizations are at, man. You guys should definitely kudos to you guys for being able to build what you guys have been able to build, because so many people are still trailing behind on this whole space, man, on what it looks like to meet people where they're at. I think it's a it's a huge factor nowadays more than ever, especially when we also not only got our young adults going to school, but our parents are so much more involved into that with our young adults as well. Can imagine you as a parent are very involved into your child's you know, education. So, yeah, how do we meet the students where they're at? How do we meet the parents over there? Like, there's a lot of different pieces and data gives us all that information. We got good data, man. I love that.

[27:53]  Right, right, which is why you had your earlier question about Why are people worrying and scared about AI? mean, AI is just basically taking data and helping you look at it, right? It's actually

[28:02]  Yeah.

[28:03]  speeding it up for you. Cause now you don't have to search for all the data and you can just ask questions. It'll say, okay, here's some of the things we found. Do you think it's right? It's great. It's a great, great way of doing it.

[28:13]  yeah. You mentioned earlier the mission of the school. What is the mission of Raghu? What does he want to leave behind? What does that legacy look like for him when someone thinks about Raghu? What is someone going to say? Or you would hope that they say.

[28:24]  Look, mean, my thing is like, I actually, I think of differently. The people I work with, I just want to leave, you know, their impression should be like, we really enjoyed working together, right? From a university perspective, I should be invisible. At the end of

[28:44]  Mm-hmm.

[28:44]  the day, the students are what matters. The employers that we work with that matters. The community colleges we work with, all that matters. As long as they're successful. doesn't matter if they know me or not. So my legacy is gonna be their success.

[28:59]  Love it, man. You're in that passion and purpose space, man. You're not chasing a paycheck, are you?

[29:05]  No, this is about making real results for others. That's what this industry is about. That's what the job is about, and that's what the university is about.

[29:13]  Yeah, man, given other people the opportunity that they never even knew existed. And, you know, so I love it. I love that you're in this space, man, that you found something that makes you happy, that still wakes you up every morning, probably doesn't feel like work sometimes. And as you mentioned, just really filling your cup as you're seeing some of the people succeed in their lives. Some people probably and I can imagine you hear these all the time. People probably never even thought that they'll be able to get a degree, you know, and to be able to do that at their time in their homes.

[29:33]  People probably never even thought that they'll be able to get an degree. To be able to do that at their time and take their own career. There's some amazing things about that. We've got a very different space. where they're at in the master's, people that's not at, but even where they're at in their lives, people are very free.

[29:42]  Right. think there's some amazing things about that. And you guys are very different in that space. Meeting people where they're at, not just through the class, but even where they're at in their lives. These are 30, 40. Do you know what the average age is? Do you guys have that?

[29:58]  Average age of our students is about 38. Like I

[30:01]  Wow.

[30:01]  they're all working adults. They're there to move up in their careers. We have people that are getting undergrad degrees, they're coming back for graduate degrees. We help them whenever they need help around.

[30:13]  I'm gonna have to check it in. I'm at an associate. I am two classes away from the associates. That's why when I was working for the airline, I was taking the online classes and I was like, I think you guys and somebody else's and some people may have done different curriculums and you know, really meeting me where I was at. I'll take one class.

[30:26]  We'll be getting to that in a

[30:27]  I'll take two classes. I all these different things. So I'm had to come back to you guys at some point and say, Hey man, I got to finish a damn degree. Not that I felt like I needed it, but it's something that no one can take away. And I think that's the best part about it. No one can take away the degree that you've worked very, very hard for. And also, it doesn't matter how long it takes for you to get there. I started school in my early 20s. I am 36 years today, so almost at the average that you're talking about.

[30:42]  And also, it doesn't matter how long the case can sit there. I started school in early 20s. I am serving a state career today, but I'm with the Fed. There you are, yeah.

[32:04]  man, man, I really appreciate it.

[32:04]  But you're totally right. There's no time frame. You just do it when you can do it, right? you're right. There's a lot talk about degree. Yeah, it is still a measure. It is a milestone. It is something that we should all be proud of achieving because it is not easy. It is a lot of work. It's not simple. But it actually is. You develop a lot in ways you don't even realize as you go through all the learning around it. Yeah, I agree. You should never give up because you never stop learning and life's more exciting the more you learn.

[32:04]  Absolutely. Mr. Raghu, where can people find more information if they're kind of stuck and may want to do this and maybe just need some

[32:04]  people find information there on the stuff they may want to do this.

[32:04]  more information? What is the URL? Can they email? Can they go to social and find out more? Where's all this platforms?

[32:04]  I always encourage people to go to our website. It's phoenix.edu. There's lots of information on there. There's even a search tool on there. You can find out what you want more quickly. It's a great resource to find out about the university, what we do for others, and how others have taken and used what their learning is to be successful afterwards.

[32:04]  Well, I appreciate you, man. I appreciate the conversation. Appreciate what you've done and really pouring yourself into the sector where it's much needed. It is a very always evolving sector. And it seems like you're the man to continue to lead that path, man. You're you're getting educated. You're staying with the times because you're young kids. So never lose that either. Continue to stay tapped in. Learn the lingo. Right, Mr. Raghu. We got to meet people where they are. But now, guys, thank you. If you guys are still watching, make sure you

[32:30]  That's right.

[32:30]  guys do like, subscribe and comment. This has been Mr. Raghu.

[32:32]  This is the end of the review. I'm including only.

[32:34]  I'm Ephraim, we'll catch you the next one. Bye just.