Breaking Trauma Cycles: Jill Nosach on How One Adult Changes Everything

[0:16]  Welcome back to another episode here on the hard hustle podcast with Jill, another leader doing amazing things. Jill, we appreciate you coming on in. Um, if you could just kind of start off people, what is the organization you represent and what is your title?

[0:27]  Sure, I'd be happy to. Thank you so much for inviting me here today. I'm really looking forward to talking with you. So, my name is Jill Nosatch and I am the CEO of SOS Children's Villages USA. Love it. Love it. We're going to just start off with a really kind of good question here before we kind of get into what you guys are doing at that organization. How do we break cycles of trauma that span generations? One of the things that we talked about and um you said to believe you believe it starts with one adult saying, "I'm here. I see you. you matter. Did you experience that in your own life or you just realize as you grew older that that we need that one person to just kind of be there to continue to uplift us when we are down? How did that come about?

[1:10]  Oh, what a great series of questions. I think one thing you asked is did I experience that as a child? And absolutely yes. There were adults in my life who were trustworthy, who let me understand that I mattered to them, that I was important. Um, and that can either enhance your life right from day one or also it can actually change and rewire your brain. So if you've had adverse experiences a child and you are in a place where you don't feel loved and you don't feel worthy and you you will start to be not only mentally ill but physically ill. Once you start experiencing and continue over time to experience things like trusted relationships, feeling loved, feeling part of a community, engaging in education, um your brain will actually start to heal. So your trauma will reduce, your emotional responses will normalize. But even more miraculous to me is that your physical health also improves. And there's been lots of studies on this. Um, and it's it to me it's just absolutely amazing. And it is something that I felt the power of in in my own life. And I'm so humbled to now be able to play a very small part in other people's lives. And it's it's very rewarding.

[2:53]  How long have you been in the space? I have been in the nonprofit sector for almost 40 years.

[3:01]  Four or 40?

[3:02]  40.

[3:04]  Oh my god. You come on. Come on. No way. You look great. 40 years. Oh, long time. Long time. You know, for me, I always say 10 years. But when I hear somebody say four decades. Yeah. That is you truly just living in purpose, the passion. When did you realize that this was the mission that you wanted to because I feel when you're in that nonprofit space especially that you're in the space of really giving back. you're wanting to help someone overcome something or someone something with you know when you're in the nonprofit that's really all it is it's you helping the next what got you to that when did you realize this is the mission I want to continue to give back for the rest of my life

[3:37]  oh what a great question I you know I fell back into higher education and I experienced the power of education and what what a life-changing uh event it can be when you when you have a college degree, not because of the degree, but because it was something that maybe didn't feel attainable in your family situation. And once you do that, then for me, it was something that I wanted to make sure was available for others who were interested in pursuing it. And I was still working in that space when a dear friend of mine uh wanted me to join her organization. And I was like, "No, I'm I'm doing really good work. You know, it it brings me joy. It brings other people joy. It changes the world. Like why why would I do anything else with my life?" And she said, "Well,

[4:34]  you know, there's a lot of a lot of children who don't go to school at all. Can you help me understand the value of higher education when after 10 years old you don't go to school at all? And I was just thunderruck like

[4:54]  okay no I I really can't answer that question. Tell tell me more about the space you work in. Um, and and that's how I really got involved in better understanding the importance of your entire childhood and youth and that it doesn't begin with higher education. It really begins with trust and it really begins with love. Um, and even if it doesn't begin with trust and love, trust and love coming in can really be transformative. Where where do you think it gets lost? Trust and love

[5:36]  everywhere.

[5:38]  It's hard,

[5:38]  you know. And I I say that I sit here and think, right, like my um just recently where I think Diwali just happened or something like that. So, we went and gave our neighbors um some chocolate that day and she obviously gave back my daughter that's only four years old like an apple and some stuff and my daughter automatically took it, right? And it's, you know, as parents, you're like, we don't just take anything from strangers even though it's a neighbor. But my daughter responding, she wouldn't hurt us. Like, why are you guys so upset, right? Cuz she has this trust in them. When do we lose trust? When do we lose love? Like it it is something that we all I feel kind of grow up with, born with, and at some point something happens. Is it within the family? Is it is it strangers? Like what do you think that all stems from?

[6:24]  I think it all depends. Unfortunately, it can happen right in your family. I mean, this is this is something we know. This is why we have so many systems in place for children. Um, and you know, why that happens uh is is probably a whole another podcast, right? But the the effect on a child, it can be what they what they learn and the only thing that they know and then it becomes something that they carry with them and pass on to the next generation. Um, and I think you also speak to a really good point of awareness. Um, I'm sure you've noticed with your own children, there's a point where they're very happy to be held by almost anyone and then there's a point where they become my grandmother called it strange where they're suddenly aware of this isn't this isn't my my mother or my father or my family and they're uncomfortable or they'll cry when you put them in someone else's arms. Right? there's that that awareness of perhaps I'm not safe here. Um, and then you see that again with young children like you were talking about with your daughter where there's a period where they're very trusting and accepting if they haven't experienced uh traumatic hurt or abuse or neglect. So, they're very willing to take that apple. They're very willing to bite right into it because they they just universally trust. But experience could could teach them otherwise. It could be being pushed down on the playground. It could be being bullied. It could be

[8:10]  not being noticed in school when they're raising their hands. You know, it could be many things where they start to realize like, oh, not I'm the center perhaps of my parents. universe, but I'm not only not the center of everyone else's, there are actually some people who will do me harm. And and you you learn that you learn that in on the playground, you know, you learn that at school. Unfortunately, it's it can be a part of life. I think it is a part of life. So then if it's small, your own resilience and how you overcome it um is a strong factor. But if it's larger and you can come to a trusted adult, you can come to your mom or your dad or your grandmother or your caregiver and they can help you through that, that's where you can then regain that trust.

[9:04]  I love it. And and what when we talk about let's kind of go back to the organizational um part of things that you you deal with on a day-to-day, what does that look like? What are some of the program services? What does the dayto-day look like for you guys?

[9:14]  Sure. Um well the day-to-day can vary in um many contexts. So what we do is we provide the care that you would need if your parents are no longer with you. Um, and that could be because they've passed away or that could be because you've been removed from your family because your family was a place where you experienced neglect or abuse. Um, and so basically we raise a child. We have a couple of components. We keep all siblings together. Um, so unlike some of the foster care that we're familiar with in the United States, um, we don't remove one child from the family. We keep all of the children together where it's in the best interest of the child. Certainly, if one of the siblings is um one of the abusers or part of the problem, then we're we're not going to keep you all together. Um but keeping all the children together and creating a new nuclear family with caring adults. Um and the adults are trained in traumainformed care, right? to they're trained to recognize and react to trauma that they're seeing uh in their young people so they can provide the safety and security that these children need. Um so a typical day to get to your question probably looks like a typical day in your household. Um we're getting up, we're having breakfast, we're getting ready for school. Um did we finish our homework? Did we brush our teeth? and off we go. And you know, then it's coming home in time for snack and homework and outside play. And maybe there's a visit to the doctor and uh maybe there are playdates like you would have with any other home to make sure that a full sense of community is experienced by the child, you know. And then as they're growing up, that starts to change. And we start looking at things like, well, um, what would what would you need for a part-time job after school? Or maybe you are an athlete and and what does that look like? And what is the schedule to get you to all the games you need to be at? or maybe you're an artist or a poet, you know, and you're developing into a teenaged person and all of the joy that comes with that and also all of the struggles that can come with that. And then

[11:47]  for the oldest trials for us up to the age of 24 or so, cuz I don't know about you, but I don't many know many people that are 18 were just magically self-sufficient adults. Um so we will work on that bridge to self-reliance and independence. Um which is different for each of us. Although there's some core tenants of you know learning what it is to be self-accountable, what it is to be to make our own choices and suffer the consequences of those choices and also to make our own decisions and cook our own meals and do our own laundry and and all of those things. So any typical day could probably look like

[12:31]  Is this like a um like a group home in a sense?

[12:34]  It actually is not. Um what we typically do, what might constitute a village, a children's village, would be several individual homes. Um each of which could house eight or 10 children. not because we want to have so many children in the home, but because we do want to keep all of the siblings together and families come in all shapes and sizes. Um, and then a village might have eight or 10 of those homes. Depending where you are in the world because we're in more than 130 countries, the context is is very different. Some of our villages aren't villages at all. their their individual apartments across several different apartment buildings in a big city. Um, some have a more foster care type arrangement like we're more familiar with in the United States. Others have a permanent caregiver um throughout the entire time, you know, from birth to 24. Uh, and others you're with a shorter time because it all depends on on the child and what their need is. So typical day is hard, but if you think you're raising a child,

[13:47]  that's what it

[13:48]  No, this is uh cool. I mean, I'm I um only asked because I remember my brother being a group home, right? And what that actually looked like. So I asked those questions because I think I told you I was adopted. So when you talk about a lot of kids, bological mom had 10 kids, you know, and we're all kind of spread out in the sense. Luckily, my aunt that adopted me adopted me and two other siblings, but there's other siblings that we never got to see. Um because once they're adopted by someone else or once they're in the system, you know, you don't know about that individual anymore, right?

[14:15]  And we were just actually talking about, you know, some of these siblings that we just don't know. You know, one day we could really come across a sibling and don't even know it's our sibling. Um and it's really sad to know that that's what happens when we get put into the systems. Kind of what you going back to what you mentioned that um being 18 years old like no one knows. Yeah. It's so hard. Like you think you're you know it and you're 18 years old and you know I was one of those at 18 years old. I I wanted to leave home and I remember as soon as I graduated high school, I left home and it was tough, you know, and and and there were so many things that I had to really learn um just by failing at times, you know, but if we can really prepare our young adults to to to live on their own, what it actually looks like to pay their own bills, what it look like to save money, like there's that financial uh uh part that we don't know as much either, you know, for whatever reason it may have been, whether the school system have failed us, whether home has failed us. There's so many things to really learn. I love that you guys are really pouring into that, you know, into what it looks like when a child is aging out and not just leaving them high and dry because a lot of times that's just kind of what happens to um people when they age out, you know.

[15:22]  What's what's the biggest thing that you learned at that time? I mean, that's so compelling hearing you talk about leaving home at 18, right? Because I we all want to be independent and or maybe we don't all want to be independent, but I wanted to be

[15:35]  Well, you know, Jill, I did. I definitely did want to be independent because um being me being adopted, I was at home feeling like um you know, I felt unloved. I felt unseen at times. Um I I felt the difference of how she was raising her own kids versus us.

[15:52]  Um and and and now, you know, as an adult, I just realized she did the and this is one of the things she mentioned to me, and I I thank her for this was um I did the best I could with what I knew. She was also a young mom. I mean late 20s, mid20s, she already had seven kids, four of her own and took on three of her sisters. So, you know, this is someone that moved from Lawrence where it was nothing but gangs for down to Florida with seven kids for a better life. Like when you think about it and me being a parent, I understand, you know, and I'm I am thankful even though so many things were happening in my life, this is a mom that did this

[16:26]  by herself. She didn't have to take on her sister's kids, but she felt compelled to do so. So what I what I've just I knew I wanted to leave at 18, you know, and I never looked back and was there was times that maybe I struggled a little bit. Yeah. But I was also one of those fortunate ones that at 19 years old I was already running a sub shop making $50,000 a year. That's not everybody's story, right? But it it was kind of going back to what you mentioned was someone believed in me. It was a man, it was a new supervisor that walks in and sees Ephrain and his work ethic at 18 and seeing him day, you know, all day.

[17:02]  And a lot of it was cuz I didn't want to be home. So, I rather have worked, right? I felt more comfortable at work. I feel like I can be myself, you know, the I had so much energy like I can do after the school program. So, there was a lot of reasons I was there at work.

[17:14]  Plus, I didn't have a home to go to, right? I told you I left home at 18 years old. Um, so there was just a lot of factors for me on what I felt like. I just felt like I I grew. All that was just really learning lessons. And I talk about financial situations because I remember making all this money. And every week, Joe, I go buy me two pair of shoes. I'm buying this. But in reality, I should have been able to invest in a home and a new car. I was still driving a 94, you know, Honda Civic. And but no one told me how to save money or where to utilize money. So, I love that you guys are mentioning that just that is we're setting them up for what life has to offer. I even go back to a friend that I had that him and his sister were separated. So, he felt like he was kind of on his own at times. And when I found out he was 18, still living in a home um with four other foster kids. And you know, at 18 years old, they start to

[18:05]  receive these checks out as long as they're in school. So, when I found out she was charging him $500 when he was only getting $1,000, it bothered me, you know. So, I had just had rented a five- bedroomedroom house at 19 years old and I said, "Hey, just move in with me. I'll charge you $300. You have your own room, but you have to go to school and get a job. You know, I'll help you get a job." And I did. I helped him get helped him get a job. Um, I was like his legal guardian even though I was like a year, two years older than him because I just had this I had to I was forced to grow up, right, Jill? And you hear that a lot. I was forced to grow up and um just seeing what that looked like, me just being a part of his life and how he changed his life and how he did go to school and then when I wasn't part of his life, how his life changed and he's no longer with us. I'm sorry.

[18:51]  Right. It's having someone that believes in you is so crucial in life,

[18:56]  you know, and I even kind of go back to the people that are working for you in these villages like how do you empower them to be that one person? I think that's important as well, right? It's not just a job. You got to be that person. How do you empower them to do that?

[19:11]  Well, that's such a great question because it's there's so much to what you just said. I think a lot of it is also believing in them. Um,

[19:21]  and making sure they feel that, right? So, uh, you're running the household. So, you run the household, right? No one want we don't want to be micromanaging. So it's also having faith and trust with strong systems. Um because child protection of course is the number one thing that we do. If someone is in our care then we have to make sure that that everything is as it should be. So there there is you know oversight of course and yet the power to to to raise the children as within the guidelines that we provide and that we have to follow. Um, so it's it's it's it's one of those places of tension and I think it could be with any employee or even what you were talking in about with the the young man um slightly younger than you men that you brought into your home. um finding that right place for that right individual to thrive is going to be very different because listening to your story what you needed to thrive was different than what he needed. So I think the most important thing we can do is really pay attention to each and every person that we're working with and begin to understand as best we can what they need so that they can develop their full potential and they can feel proud and happy with the work that they're doing because they're going to be better at the work that they're doing and the children that they're raising are going to be better for that. And so there's no for me anyway, I haven't found one blanket approach that works. Um because what I need and what works for me won't be what you need or what's effective for you. So that to me is on each and every leader to really listen and pay attention and know that we're not the audience. You know, each person is individual. I you started with that about people feeling and being seen and heard. Um to me those those aren't just empty words. Um there's a lot more behind that that really

[21:45]  that really motivates who we are and helps us become the best that we can be. If the Heart and Hustle podcast has ever sparked any idea or made you think differently, do us a favor. Make sure to guys share this, post it on LinkedIn, or even text that nonprofit friend that you just have. Whatever works. This is what keeps the conversation going and allows us to just grow this community together. Seriously, we appreciate you.

[22:15]  I I tell you, seen and heard is so like I grew up thinking like as I mentioned earlier, I didn't feel seen or heard, right? And um I think that really sh brings it brought a lot of things to my life. So yesterday I actually received the message from someone and now I'm like out I'm speaking I'm I'm doing TikToks. I'm doing all these different things and this girl I haven't spoke to in years she's like I'm so proud to see who you are. You were so um you were so shy and just to see who you've become is cool to see. I'm so happy for you. And and if you hear any of my friends that no one would tell you that I'm shy, but there was that right when I was going I'm ninth grade. I'm I'm this I'm being sexually abused. I'm adopted. I'm really feeling why me like you know um wanting to know why was it adopted? Where's my real mom? Where's my real father? Real father sometimes calling says he's going to be you know show up. He doesn't show up. Like there's all these things that are really kind of going through in my life. So yeah, that feeling seen and heard is very like same thing with my my parents, right? I think there was a lot of resentment there like they they didn't hear me, they didn't see me, you know, they said they were coming, they didn't. Did they really love me? All these things are kind of going through my mind. And I wasn't a shy person. It's just life was lifing. Even goes back to school. I was acting up at times. And it wasn't that I was a bad kid, right? It was it was just more of probably screaming out for help. And I don't know that our our teachers understood that. Like when we talk about teachers, there's those that understand how to work with certain type of kids. And I don't know that every teacher understood that. But then I did have teachers that would pull me aside and say, "Ephra, like this is not who you are. What's going on?"

[23:57]  Right? And those teachers I remember in my life that that they cared a lot of times is it wasn't what they said, it's how they were saying it. Right? And even as an adult, we know that it's for our own kids. We teach that. So yeah, there there's just a lot to learn. Everything everybody's a little bit different. Everybody needs to be loved a little bit different, spoken to a little bit differently. Um, you know, seen a little bit differently for who they are more importantly than anything, you know. So, I I love it, Joe. But I ask you, you're in a place where you hear these stories all the time, and there's so many different stories, and I could imagine that they're tough stories to listen to every single day, and you've done this for years. How do you how do you just like relax the mind after hearing so many things and still um have the fight for so many years after hearing so much traumatic stories that I could imagine overwhelming that could really feel like weight on your shoulders? How do you continue to show up?

[24:53]  Some days are much harder than others. You're you know that you're absolutely right. Um for me I would say that it's it's three things. One is partnership. one is nature um and the other is I'm gonna say intentionality. So starting with the third intentionality, one of the things that we've adopted um in our daily course of work is something we call mission moments. Um, and it's hearing these amazing stories either from the children themselves, from the caregivers, sometimes from another person that you're working with that are like like a bright ray of sunshine that just comes through a cloud when you've just had not just a rainy day, but you you know, you walking through a storm. And so we intentionally store those and share them with one another at the beginning of every meeting um at work because one of us probably that day has been through an experiencing that was heartbreaking or heard a story that was heartbreaking or saw something. It's so we make sure that we're reminding ourselves it's overwhelmingly good and the bad can take over and and bring us all down. Um and then we can't do the good that we're here to try to do. So that that's what I mean by intentionality. It's actually quite practical. Um and but you have to have the discipline to make that part of every meeting even though it may not feel like business. Um it is. And then for me, you know, there's a lot of talk about, you know, go outside, get in nature, and and that's good, but for me it's water. Um and it doesn't really matter if it's ocean or a lake or a river or a mud puddle. there there is something there that touches me very very deeply and I can feel myself re even just talking about it I I I relax physically mentally um and just watching the watching the water whether I'm in it or I'm on it or I'm near it um

[27:24]  it helps I mean I I you know I have a sweatshirt that says, you know, salt water heals everything. Um,

[27:32]  is that is that like your personal self-care practice tip that you give everyone?

[27:36]  Well, I can't give it to everyone because there are a lot of people who are terrified of water and look at me like, wait, but what is it for you? You know, we we all have our thing or we haven't found our thing yet. And I'm and I'm lucky enough that that I've found mine and I've recognized it and I will seek it out. Um because it it it's amazing how much that helps me. Um and then the third is partnership. You know, we've we've talked a lot today about being seen and being heard and being loved. Um, and I'm very very fortunate that I have a wonderful husband who who sees me and who I see. Um, and he's also in the caregiving space. My husband's a registered nurse. Um, so, you know, it's amazing to to find someone who we don't agree on everything. We don't see everything the same way. You know, there are different things that motivate and inspire us, but at the end of the day, our value system and our care for one another,

[28:41]  is it's just it's a safe place. Um, and

[28:47]  I don't know about you, but I need a safe place, you know, a place where it's like, okay, here's me.

[28:53]  The good, the bad, the things I should have done differently, the things I still hope to do. and it's accepted and that that kind of unconditional acceptance. Um,

[29:06]  so those are the three things for me.

[29:09]  Love it. No, I can tell you and your husband have that love for humanity. Um, for sure. You know, even though sometimes may not agree for everything, but it's still the love for people is what that is really the common denominator there, which is always cool to know that you can have a partner that really does care. And and and I think that's so important to have a partner that cares, that uplifts you, that is there for you on the good times and the tough times. I I would always I mean I think this is why I married my wife actually. Uh I would remember when when we first met, we were just dating probably not even a year in and she was the first that was the first time I really talked about being sexually abused and you know life was happening and she was seeing these anger issues in me and realizing like wait a minute like you're this good person but when you're mad and like I don't know who you are anymore you know and hearing that I was like what do you mean and she's like you don't become like this monster you know and and I didn't want to be that. I knew I wasn't that, right? And she says, "Even if we were not, if even if we don't work out, I just want to help you heal. I just want you to help you overcome." And when she said that to me, I just never heard that in my life, you know, and I was like, "Oh my god." Like that was it, you know, I'm marrying this girl and I did. Here we are now, you know, 13, 14 years later.

[30:16]  Congratulations.

[30:18]  That partnership and partnership could mean in a relationship, it could mean those good friends. um you know even that sometimes having what I've realized at 35 years old right last year was that there was friends that they're great friends but sometimes was almost dimming my light right that negativity that they would call you with the negativity they would always call you about the drama that they was going in their lives but they're never really asking how are you doing in times that sometimes I needed that right um so finding friends that are really there for you are not just there to take from you I think it's really important that you guys can really kind of balance that both out so partnership um in in jobs, right? There's having those good partners that you also work with, I think, is also important. We need positivity in our lives. We need people that care for us just as much as we care for others because usually we're very very caring people, but we realize people don't care for us. And I think that's what one of the things I was um struggling at one point. I I always felt actually John, I don't know if you ever heard something like this, like I remember telling this guy, I'm the guy that always calls somebody to check up on them.

[31:19]  Past, you know, coworker, past teacher, past friend, whatever. And in a point in my life when I was really struggling, I realized no one was calling me. And I said, you know, why am I calling everybody else and no one texts up on me, right? That strong person everyone thinks. And he says, he Frank, just continue to do what you do and just never change who you are.

[31:39]  Oh,

[31:39]  you'll find those,

[31:41]  you know. So you said, go ahead, J. You have something to say there. But when I heard that, it was it was very strong when he said that because it's very true. But I'll let you talk on it, Joe, because I know there's a lot to say there. I just said, "Oh, wow." I just was very moved by what you said. I Please, I don't mean to interrupt.

[31:57]  No, no. It's a good conversation. I just love that we get to talk like this because a lot of people don't realize it. Sometimes you just need someone in your life that sees you sometimes more than you see yourself. And I've I I'm have been blessed. I actually had a conversation recently with my neighbor as well and he says, "Out of all your mom's kids, those 10 kids that were all adopted, what makes you special?" Because a lot of them are still living that repetitive life, right? They're still kind of in that same cycle.

[32:25]  And really what we've been saying this whole time, I had people in my life that believed in me.

[32:30]  I had people whether it was friends, whether it was co-workers, whether it was strangers I met one time in my life and I took that one positive thing, you know, um undercover boss. I don't know if you knew that I was an undercover boss, but I still remember what that chief development officer said to me. If my son grows up to be anything like you, I'll be a happy father. Well, I grew up with no father. So, what those words still resonate with me. So, the day that I actually became a father, I called him back and I said, if I can be a great father, anything close to you, I know I made it in life. Right? And to this day, is those people that really just pour into you. You're going to hear a lot of negative things in your life, but you're also going to hear a lot of positive. It's learning how to kind of balance both between both of those and realize that all the negative that's happening, it's just someone else's negative mindset. It it doesn't have to be yours.

[33:19]  So, yeah, I I the space that you're in is quite special. Do you recall like a a story that um that really continue to inspire you that you know that this is why I do it? you know that maybe after you heard it or you seen or you lived it that you kind of shook your head and say, "You know what? This is why I do what I do." Any moment comes to mind.

[33:39]  Oh my. There there's just so many. Um, three of the members of our board of directors are adults who grew up in our system and in in one of our homes um with one of our our SOS moms and we've been talking recently, we went through a a strategic planning summit, right, as boards do. Um,

[34:08]  and one of them was sharing on their experience and and what it was like to grow up with their siblings and this mix of biological siblings and SOS siblings and their SOS mom and the connection in the family and it it's it's sort of what you just said when times get tough and there's a lot happening in their space, they reach out and call their SOS mom and their SOS brother to say, "How are you doing? How are you handling this? Are you are you taking this in the same way I am? And and how are you coping with it? And how are you doing?" Um, and that that giving and taking I I think is just so important. And it and it and it strikes me. I I don't have any siblings of my own. Um, and so I listen to those those conversations with with delight. Um, and I, you know, I've I've found that kind of relationship with friends and with my husband and with with my parents. Um, but not having those siblings and hearing people talk about how important that is throughout their life. It's not like it was a childhood thing. It's it's an adult thing. Um, so that's one that that really struck me. And that same person was also talking about the birth of of their children and then watching their children grow into adulthood and that satisfaction of of being a good parent. Um although their own parents didn't model that, their SOS parents did. And that that lifechanging not just for this generation but for the next generation that spark for me that's everything

[36:20]  that's what I realiz I think becoming a parent even before a parent but definitely becoming a parent when I realized life is not even about me

[36:27]  it's about everybody else right it's about my kids it's about their family and what that actually looks like we're breaking cycles Right. So that's what it's all about. And and and it it what led me to go to therapy, even though I probably needed all my life, was when I became a father

[36:44]  and thinking for myself, right? Because it was 2 years old when I was taken away from my mom. And as my kids kind of approached the age of two, um that's what's kind of ran through my head. Like I couldn't even imagine, you know, like I remember telling my wife if please if anything happens in this relationship and we become parents that we work this out because I did not want to repeat the same cycle that I' I've witnessed. I didn't know what a father looked like, but I knew that I I I knew what it I don't need to do, which is please at least show up, be present, you know, because a lot of times that's all they have to do is just show up, be present. I think that makes a difference. um and whatever for whatever reason they they don't and that's just kind of their life. But um there was those moments that I was kind of thinking you know because now believe it or not even though I have all these brothers and sisters kind of to what you just mentioned my friends and the ones that my my kids know as their Titi and Tio are actually my best friends. Two two girls that they call Titi and then obviously their husbands I've been friends with them as well. So that's Tio. When we talk about friends giving it's me and that same group of friends. We've been doing this for the last 10 years even before we had kids. um you know when it comes for Christmas same thing we come together like I was able to really find family outside of my actual family find those people one we talked about those people that really care for you that are there for you because these are people that I can call at any time and were there for me these are friends that we didn't even like each other Jill you know when we were in high school but we've learned to love each and it was because they I used to make fun of them all the time so they hated that I made fun of them but they realized it was just Ephrain showing love that's how Ephra show love if he made fun of you, it was a good thing. He liked you, you know. So, uh, having to really learn different, um, one's Jamaican, one's Puerto Rican. It's like, but these are to my to my kids, they just they don't know any better. That's TT and that's Tio,

[38:35]  you know. So, it it is in a space I love that as we grow older and we have people in our lives, they allow us to see things differently and allow us to see past ourselves at times. I go back and think about um my I remember when I my mother-in-law I'm fortunate for my mother-in-law to live with us and every time my mother-in-law comes home my my wife is like forget her husband and she's talking to her mom and I at one point I felt some type of way again I didn't grow up like this so I didn't know what it looked like to have a bond with your mother right or or a parent so I I would ask my wife like man did you marry me or your mother but then when she put in perspective of like I just love my mom. That is my best friend. And I have all these conversations. How would you want your daughter? Would you not want your And when she said that, I'm like, you're right. We're trying to break cycles. So just because I didn't grow up like this doesn't mean this is not good for us, right? I only knew from what I experienced in my life. So it goes back to just having good people in your life. just whether it's a a parent, whether it's a a girlfriend, boyfriend, a friend, find those people that care for you and are telling you things that are going to better you, not hold you back. And when we find those people in our lives, and that's what your organization does is that you guys intentionally put people that care, that are leaders into these villages that are uplifting and not just bringing them back. they're already going through so much in their lives. Why would we put someone that that's going to continue to break them down? So, I love what you're doing and I think that we actually need more leaders in these spaces, right? And I think a lot of people want to be in these spaces, Jill. So, what would you say to someone actually considering leaving corporate for mission work, but they may be worried about the risks? I think usually what happens people are afraid. Well, I don't get the paycheck, but I always say you get purpose and passion that that actually so it's worth so much more. But what is your thoughts on that? you know, I I make a good living. Um, and I'm able to help others at the same time. For me, that's the right mix and the right balance. Um, we're I we're able to provide for our family. Um, we have a house with a roof over our heads, you know, and uh you talked about your mother-in-law living in your house. My my we have my parents living next door. Um, so Okay. So, what more could I want? Um,

[41:09]  but that works for me, you know, and so someone who's concerned about the risk, well, what will I do if my if my paycheck is smaller? What will I think, you know, you go back and do some of the things you might have learned as a kid, like they used to call it the Ben Franklin list, right? What am I looking for? What's important to me? Is it is it more important to me at this stage in my career um to have financial security? Financial security, as you said much earlier, is really important. Are you am I starting a family? Am I expecting a family to go to college? Do I have elderly or other people in my life that I'm financially responsible for? You know, that may be the only the only path I feel like I can choose at this moment. So maybe you volunteer somewhere first and get a sense of how fulfilling for you is it to be missiondriven, right? You can test the water. You don't have to jump from one to the other. um you can but you can also move a little more slowly and see if this is important to you and also see if it helps you sometimes shed some burdens um the trajectory of your career um you know sort of up or out right like keep improving keep getting a raise, keep working harder, keep working longer hours. Is is that right for you? um is that allowing you to be present and show up for your family or for whomever you want to show up maybe even only for yourself uh and I don't mean only yourself right but like you know are you getting what you expected out of it um because we all need different things and if you need that sense of purpose like I do then this is a really good way forward. And there are and a nonprofit is a business, right? I'm we just I'm not investing. Our profits don't go to shareholders. Our profits pour into children. And so we still run like a business. So the we're full of accountants and finance people and marketers and you know, all of the skill sets that if you're in corporate America, you have those skill sets are here as well. um we're not we're not just looking to do good. We're actually, you know, running a serious business. And so you can fit really really well in our space. Um, and we need folks who understand those disciplines and can bring the rigor of the corporate world into the nonprofit sector day in and day out because at the end of the day, that's how we're going to change the world. And you get to decide, are you an environmental person? Are you a person interested in children? Are you a person interested in research around disease? I mean, there's there's so many aspects of the nonprofit sector. We talk like it's one thing,

[44:25]  but you can find where your passion is. Um,

[44:29]  and and join some movement and make it better with the skill set that you bring. Um, and you might be surprised at how fulfilling that is. And sometimes if your life allows it, you can find that that is actually more rewarding um than the than the financial gains, but we're not all in the same boat, you know.

[44:59]  Yeah. Yeah. We our missions are not all the same, right? Um however, you can give back in so many different ways. I go back my neighbor, I probably mentioned him so many different times on podcasts, but it's because I work out with this guy. I see him all the time, but he's an electrician. And he's like, you know, sometimes Ephrain didn't have kids. He wanted kids. Now he's almost 50 years old, you know, so his time's probably of having kids is is kind of coming to an end here. And um I said, "Hey, just because you you wanted to be a father and you weren't able to, doesn't mean that there's not people out there that you can be a father to, a father figure to, right? Or or you know, there's so many men out there, young boys that need a man figure in their life. If you really want to make that impact, it's still possible. Find these nonprofits." He's he's an electrician. And I said, if you want to, you know, give back, there's many nonprofits that may just need someone to do electrical work in their establishments and you can volunteer your time, you know, and and maybe mentor um, you know, just Google it. Google whatever it is that you love. I say Google a nonprofit. I can imagine it comes up in the space that you love and you have this passion for. And then you get to realize that you get to pour into those that may not for whatever reason be able to um enjoy the things that you enjoy, whatever that may look, you know, look like. So,

[46:09]  and and sometimes right in your own community, right in your own community, you might find something, you know, you feel like you know nothing about. I I mentioned I had no siblings. Um, so I have no brothers. So, my father had no sons. My father was the boy scout leader in because they needed one, you know, he knew nothing about it, but that's what was was necessary, you know. So then he went off to to Boy Scout camp, you know, and he learned about camping and all the things that you have to pass on, but it really wasn't about the camping or any of the other things. It was about having a trusted adult and being a

[46:48]  It was never about him. As we said, it's not about us,

[46:51]  you know. So, it's amazing the ways that you can get involved if you just offer your service. It's it's unbelievable. Before we get into our last question, the blind question, the hot seat question, if you could challenge um one thing every listener to do this week to support a child in need, what would it be?

[47:12]  If I could challenge a listener one thing they could do for a child this week, pay attention, listen, see them, give a little support. That's what I mean. We need to be loved, right? We need to be seen. We need to be heard. And even just a smile um can go a long way. You you might never know the difference you made that your kind words made. You talked earlier about teachers. There's so many times in your life where you hold on to something kind to you. Um, and when you really need it, it's there. And everybody who's listening today can be that person for some child today, this moment. Um, so I encourage you to do it because not only is it good for the child, you're going to feel good, too.

[48:15]  You say that, Joe. And in reality, it's not only our kids, it is

[48:19]  just everyone,

[48:20]  right? All of us. And I'll tell you this story that I heard last night before I went to bed before I we start to wrap it up. But I thought it was a really good story. So this is kind of like comedian guy that I see online all the time and he um likes go doors to door and sells like a cleaning spray, right? It could clean your carpet, could clean your shoes, whatever. But he's always a jokester and the way that he's just so quick on his feet and makes people laugh with some of the things that he says. So he says, "I go up to this door and this lady comes out and she's just yelling at us and you know I he made a joke. He walks away and she's like, "Hey, come back." And she's like, "What did you say?" And he says the joke again and she just starts to chuckle. She's like, "That's so funny." She's like, "Listen, I've never seen anyone that sells be so funny like you." She says, "Listen, I wouldn't love to know what you're selling." He said, "No, it's okay. Don't worry about it. I don't want to bother you." This like, "No, it's okay. Come inside." Um, oh, she said, "Can it clean my carpet? If it cleans my carpet, I'll buy it." He says, "I can actually show you." So, she said, "Come on inside." He says, "I as I come inside, there was a gun on the table." And as a joke, he says, "Please don't shoot. I'm just a just a black man trying to sell whatever whatever." And she her response was, "No, thank you. Before you knocked on this door, I was going to take my life." Like, wow. When we treat people respect and kindness, allow people to be seen and heard, what that does for someone else. You know, when you hear that, like really showing up at the right time, it's those times where your kids are asking a question where they just want to be heard. They want to be seen, can truly make the difference on what it looks like for them tomorrow. And it's not just our kids, it's our adults. We're in a time right now in 2025 where we're so divided, you know, and I know we were talking about we're talking about our young kids and but what you just mentioned is it has to be everybody

[50:06]  because how we respect others out in the world, our kids pick that up as well.

[50:11]  So I try to make sure that who I am in home is exactly the same person I'm outside because my kids are watching every single step that dad does. the way he talks, the way he carries himself, the way he talks, you know, carries talks to other people, the way he helps other people. If we want to change and break the cycle, it's up to us and it's the thing that we do every single day. So, I love that you talked about that. Um, I just wanted to end up on on that note, but before we even wrap it up to that blind question as I mentioned, what's your socials? Where can people find more information if they want to really figure out what are you doing at the organization level and just be a part of it? They want to also just u maybe volunteer.

[50:46]  Sure. Um, so I would direct you uh to our website. We are sos-usa.org. So sosusa.org. Very very simple and easy. Um, and once you're there, you can see who are the children we're we're working with, what does that look like, what is the change that happens. Um, and you can also there's very simple ways to get involved. Um like we offer we offer a gift shop. We call our gift shop love delivered uh because they're real products and real uh real time um things that children need, you know. So yes, you can provide food and shelter, but you could also provide a sewing machine to a young person who has a dream of how they're going to survive financially if there's no strong economy where they live. And so they have to be in the informal economy and make their own way in the world. or you know, you could provide a pair of glasses for a child who can't see or any other adaptive equipment that a young child or an older child might need. Um, so there's there's some cool things there that are that are different and remind us um of what that might look like. And you can also take a look at, you know, what are our core values? What is the mission we stand by? Um, and what opportunities are there for you to become an important person in someone else's life if where you live and how you live doesn't seem to be providing you the opportunity that you're looking for?

[52:34]  This has been a good conversation. I leave you with this last question. You lead an organization dedicated to children and families, but what's one personal fear or failure you've never publicly shared that shaped the way you actually lead today? I'm always afraid that I'm going to say the wrong thing. I like to laugh and I like to joke and I I'm I'm afraid that I might hurt somebody unintentionally with with words that I mean in love and yet they're not received that way. And that always worries me. Um, so I I I sometimes will laugh about something and then think I I'm kidding, right? You know, I'm kidding because you might be coming from a place where somebody used humor against you. Um, and I'm always afraid of that. Uh,

[53:28]  yeah. Offline, I'll tell you one that I that happened because we got to wrap up here because it is true. You got to be very very mindful. We're we're jokesters. We love to laugh, but not everyone is in the place for it all the time. and they may look at that life a little differently than we do at times for whatever reason. So, um Jill, thank you so much for just being authentically you, just being the leader that you are today and for four decades continuing to just pour in and give back the way that you have and so many more years to come, right? This is not the end of it. There's so many more years to come. We thank you for doing this kind of work and and I hope to meet you in person and maybe one day come out to one of these villages and who knows, just just kind of show some love of someone that's kind of been in this space and understanding what it actually looks like and feels like. So guys, if you guys are still watching, make sure you guys do like, comment, subscribe. Find Jill as well on LinkedIn. You're on LinkedIn, right Jill?

[54:15]  I am.

[54:16]  She's on LinkedIn. Check out the website. Check out their socials. My name is Ephrain. This is Jill. We'll catch you on the next one. Later.