CEO Scott Burgess: How Faith Transformed Mental Health From Taboo to Healing Campuses

[0:16]  Welcome back to another episode here on the hard hustle podcast. Our next guest states, "When I started in mental health, people didn't even want to say the words out loud. Now we're actually building campuses that make healing visible and possible." I love this and I truly believe that the pandemic probably changed this all for us. But Scott, we thank you for being here, man. And you didn't fall into mental health. You you chose it and never left, which is completely rare. I ask you first question cuz we got to get right into it. People are wanting to know, what did those early days as a vocational counselor teach you that still shapes your leadership now and the things that you're doing? Yeah, I think uh one of the things that comes to mind is the fact that working with uh individuals that are going through struggles uh that you know we're all going through struggles and how do we assist with that in real time? Uh everybody has uh unique goals, everybody has unique skills, talents, interests, purpose. Uh so how do we work together to try to realize those things? So, I was doing that as a vocational counselor, working with adults that had serious persistent mental illnesses. They had significant mental health challenges, but that didn't change that they're individuals that also have dreams and aspirations and goals and skills and gifts. And so, how do we uh you know, that purpose that I had in trying to help them explore that and try to create an opportunity or opportunities for them to thrive. I think that that's really some of the fundamentals of leadership is how do you look at somebody as a unique individual? How do you help them continue to refine and enhance their strengths uh and lean into, you know, some of their unique design and giftedness to help them thrive to the highest levels. And when we do that together, do that in teamwork and collaboration partnership, it's not only great for that individual, but it's really great for the whole. and for our community.

[2:21]  Scott, I really just always appreciate talking to you on on this because truly I don't I don't think that this is a job for you. I think you shifted the mindset from being a job to being a call-in.

[2:32]  When did this actually start to feel like a call-in for you and not just something that you were just clocking in to do for the paycheck?

[2:38]  Yeah, I think it it actually a lot of it started uh just early on. Again, as I was just talking about, we're all unique and uh and have certain gifts. it just I seemed to be the type of person that people always kind of felt comfortable in sharing things with that they could kind of trust that they could um try to get some uh advice, guidance, support from. Uh so it just felt very natural to me that it's almost like the um analogy of the fish that's swimming either upstream or downstream. When you're in your the flow of the things that you are uniquely kind of more gifted at, it becomes pretty effortless and easy. uh and you're not swimming upstream. So, I just kind of always felt like that was something that was um easy for me to kind of connect with others. And then when I went off to college and um you know, I can thought about maybe business, I thought about maybe law, law enforcement, some different things like that. And I kept taking these psychology classes that just felt right. And uh though many detractors uh would say there's no way to make enough money in that, there's no way to be able to have um enough of a financial future that you can be successful in, you know, having enough money to raise a family and things like that. I just kind of always felt like from a faith standpoint that God would help take care of that if I just kind of followed what I felt my purpose was. Um, so that's kind of how the whole kind of feeling of calling came about with it. And then when I got into the field and I started having different experiences, but they all continued to validate that this felt like this was where I was intended to be.

[4:17]  I uh you said so many different things and my squirrel brain just went to two different things that you were talking about even though I had another question and it's funny because we mentioned about the squirrel brain here in just a bit, but I I do think that um what you mentioned was there was a lot of noise, right? you're doing something and people are telling you, "What are you doing? That's crazy." And you're hearing all these different things on the outside. There's a young leader right now that is facing this. They're in the space of they want to do something, but there's too much noise. Whether it's mom saying something, dad saying something, friends saying you're crazy. What that's no, there's no money to be made there. How what were who was pouring into you or what were you doing to kind of say, you know what, I got to block out that noise or how are you blocking it out? I think a lot of young leaders want to know how to get it done.

[5:00]  Sure. Well, I was I was blessed to have uh parents, you mom and dad, that were always very supportive and always wanted to uh provide uh the the support and the guidance to follow where I was, you know, kind of feeling like I was being led. So, I had that they raised me, you know, in the church and I had those affirmations from th those experiences as well. Um, but I do think that there's, you know, it's important when somebody's trying to to think about this from a kind of a career standpoint is to really tie into, you know, what your passion is because I always heard, you know, if you if you love what you do, you'll never work a day in your life. And we're going to be doing and then my dad, I remember my dad saying, you're going to be doing what you're going to be doing from a professional standpoint for 354 years. So, you better kind of like it to a certain extent, right? So, um, so I think it's tying your your career into your personal passion, which is also likely going to be where you're gifted. And if you're doing things that are feel a little bit effortless to you, but other people are saying, "Wow, that's amazing that you can do that, or you can do that so well," or, "Boy, I wish I could do it that way." Um, if you're doing something that you get lost in, you don't even realize the time's gone because you're so invested in it. Um, those are the types of things you really need to be circling around and saying, you know what, that's probably where my gifting is and that's where I need to lean into. And likely if you do that, you're going to turn out to have not only a life that's, you know, kind of from a worldly standpoint, um, successful, um, but you're going to have a life of significance, which I think is even more critically important.

[6:41]  All right, I hear you on that. I'm going to go back because I didn't have a score. I remember earlier you also said something that I want to talk about, which is your faith. Um, huge, right? I think a lot of us need to live more by faith. But one thing I heard a leader say yesterday, he says, "A faithled business will teach you more than the hustle will ever teach you."

[7:01]  What do you think about that, man? I I had to bring that to you, Scott, cuz I I know you're into it, man. What is your thoughts on something like that? He literally told me all these gems, and I says, "Hey, you said a lot of good stuff, but I'm taking that one." Like, it is so true when we think about faith, man, and and really what it does when you think that way. and and you lead with faith cuz that's I think where we we're at in today's society is that we just have to step out on faith. Yeah.

[7:26]  What is your thought, Scott?

[7:26]  Yeah, I I well I totally agree with it. Um and you know some people said, "Well, I don't have faith." I was like, "Well, well, everybody has faith." You have faith in something. I mean, are you putting your faith completely in yourself? Are you putting your faith in uh the world? Are you putting your faith in the culture? Are you putting your faith in money? I mean, everybody's putting their, you know, putting their faith in something. Um, I think, you know, the reason why a faith-driven um organization is successful is because it's built on uh the solid foundation uh of God. Uh it's not built on sinking sand. So, there's so much um that we can gravitate towards. There's so many things in this world that's competing for our time and our attention and they're trying to tell us that this is the thing that brings uh success. This is the thing that you need to do. This is the thing and that's always constantly changing. The one thing that h doesn't change and hasn't changed and won't change is the solid foundation of faith in God. So to me, I think having that grounding of knowing where you're on solid ground in a world that's constantly changing gives you, you know, not only uh the advantage uh in your personal life, but it gives you uh an advantage from a grounding standpoint in a world that's constantly changing.

[8:46]  Hey, real quick, have you enjoyed the podcast? We first want to say thank you. And we also just want to give you a little insight of what we're up to at Francis. Some don't even realize that we're working with organizations to help them use AI to create that real human communication experiences. Whe that's actually supporting your your families, those patients or the entire community. We're actually creating tech that connects. Check it out. Francis.ai. I love it. I know you enjoy that. As soon as you said faith, it brought me back to the conversation I had yesterday. I'm like, I got to bring it up. And I tell you, I started my yesterday. I have I I now have two employees, right? And that's exactly how I start off the conversation was with um a prayer that I heard that morning and because it resonated with me and I wanted to if it didn't resonate with them, you know, that they can take something out of it because I believe a lot of times we we we're asked to show up as oursel

[9:40]  that is showing up as ourselves

[9:41]  is understanding that maybe we don't serve the same God but we serve a God.

[9:45]  Right? You talked about faith. It could be faith in your kids.

[9:48]  What does that look like? Right? something that is so close to you. Now we're talking a whole different story. Now you're getting people to see things a little differently. So I love that you says, "Hey, faith could be in anything,"

[9:57]  you know. So

[9:58]  yeah,

[9:59]  I love this. But we could we could have this conversation on faith the whole time. I want to talk about mental health. Um what's the biggest shift in how mental health is actually viewed since you started? Uh well I think you you mentioned it uh at the beginning that when I first started you know a number of years ago now over 30 years um you know mental health mental illness was something that people whispered about. They didn't really talk about it. It was always very much in the shadows. It wasn't as understood. What's not understood is often something that people are scared by. Um certainly and this hasn't gotten a whole lot better but the media doesn't really help it that much. the movie portrayal doesn't help it that much. Um, there's still a lot of um, stigmatizing material that's out there about mental health, but I will say that the conversation has definitely opened up that we're now talking much more openly about mental health. Uh, the pandemic and even before the pandemic, we were starting to see generationally more people comfortable in talking about mental health. um talking about how critical mental health is to overall health and that you can't have overall health if you don't have good mental health. So I think we've really started to to turn the corner a bit on how we can talk a little bit more openly about it. Um it still is something though that u people still whisper a little bit about. you don't tend to, you know, have people feeling as comfortable uh talking around a dinner table or talking with neighbors about mental health as they would other parts of healthcare. Um but it is definitely getting better.

[11:35]  Yeah, I know. I do agree. And what I've realized, you talked about just the mental health. I also felt that it was physical health that helped me reset the mind, right? So, as I was sitting here and I working on the mind, I realized I also had to feel good about myself. And feeling good about myself allowed the the mind to trigger something where now I'm thinking a little bit differently and and about myself, right? So, I think there's there's some some avenues that people really got to tap into as well. Like, yeah, reset the mind, work on the mental health. A lot of the times you could work on mental health by just working on the physical health. It could be spiritual, right? Working on the spiritual. All these things really lead to the mental health. Um, and and I say that because I can only imagine there's some stories that really remind you why this work has to be done out loud. And it it wasn't probably always mental health, but what is that story that that you can kind of think about right now when I say um reminding you of something that has to be done out loud? Do you story?

[12:31]  Well, yeah. I mean, I can certainly tell you a story about one of the uh individuals that I still remember probably one of the first individuals that I helped. I started out um working at a children's residential uh facility and I remember going um and uh to work and all all kids um so these were anywhere between probably 6 years old to 18 years old different kind of cottages and pods and uh one just lovely beautiful young girl uh Africaname 8 years old she was at this long-term residential facility because it was her third suicide attempt. She had literally opened up a she was the passenger in her mom's vehicle. Um she opened up the the door and rolled out on the highway when she was going 75 miles an hour down the road. She survived, but she was in, you know, terrible physical and mental health shape, of course, having been her third suicide attempt. And I thought to myself, you know, very early in my career, um, what this individual must have gone through in order for her at that age to have now had a third and this a very serious serious suicide attempt. And um so to me that uh impressed upon me the magnitude of the hurting that goes on um you know in our world unfortunately and how um there need to be individuals that step into that uh and try to you know bring about help and support and healing and hope in a person's world that really doesn't have those elements at all. and how and how we can kind of work to build um those individuals up so that they can thrive. Uh not just survive, but really thrive and know that there's people that really uh care for them and want to love on them just because of who they are as a unique kind of, you know, blessing as an individual.

[14:32]  I would love to talk about that because as a young individual, it's something that we don't talk about, right? It's something that as we grew up, we're told to not have that conversation. I mean, I've seen my own family, you know, where a niece brings up something such as anxiety and a my, you know, my sibling would be like, you don't even know what that is. Do you understand what I had to go through? And it's like, your life is not their lives. That doesn't mean because just because they didn't go through what you didn't, you know, you went through that they can't have anxiety, that they can have depression because

[15:02]  life hits us very different. We have conversations with people out in the world all the time, whether it's teachers, whether it's other stu, you know, students, things like that. But I think what I'm actually really seeing, man, and I don't know if you're seeing this, is that when it comes to our youth, they're actually a little bit more comfortable now using a chat GPT almost as a therapist.

[15:19]  And it's crazy because when I speak to people kind of in this space, uh, Scott, they're saying there's no way that AI can actually play a part in it because it's not humanentric in a sense.

[15:29]  But I think it allows someone to at least open the door

[15:32]  to then realize, wait, maybe I could actually have this conversation with other people. What is your thoughts on AI and mental health and all this therapy? Are you a fan of it? Do you think that there's something that still needs to be tweaked?

[15:44]  Yeah, I I I think that there's definitely opportunity now and there will be growing opportunity for AI to play a role. Um I do think that especially with the younger generation that are more comfortable with technology that it does provide an open door for them to walk through more comfortably. A lot of uh younger individuals will have difficulty having conversations like this, looking somebody in the eye and having this type of conversation. Those are social skills that need to be developed. But if they're not comfortable sitting down and talking to somebody this way, they might feel more comfortable through utilizing some sort of technology. Maybe it's a behavioral health app that they've got on their phone that provides them, going back to the earlier conversation, it might not just be uh mental wellness tips that they can kind of pull down and maybe integrate into their life, but it could also remind them about physical health. It can remind them about nutrition. It can remind them about spiritual support and maybe having um you know, devotionals that they can go through to help build them up and support them as well. So, there are a lot of tools and resources that I think that that might help them feel more comfortable walking through that kind of quote unquote therapeutic door, if you will. Um, and then also AI has been really helpful and it's going to grow uh in its helpfulness in helping walk along with clinicians that are providing the work, you know, whether it's through scribing um to decrease decrease the amount of time that it takes to do notes or administrative duties. Um, so there's that type of AI technology that's available now. We're starting to employ some of that here at David Lawrence Centers. So that that's all very helpful. I do think that there's a fundamental human element to um somebody feeling completely connected to somebody, feeling like there's this ability to open up fully. Um, so I I don't know that we'll ever get to a point necessar I don't want to say ever, but right now I don't think we're at a point where we can substitute um the human element, the human contact of mental health counseling. Um, but you know, who knows what's technology is going to bring down the road and how people become more and more comfortable um with that technology. And I I know you can agree when I say this. I always love people to real to to understand that when it comes to therapy, the first person, it could have been a bad experience. Doesn't mean we give up, right? I I look at it, I always say this, but it's like dating someone. You got to keep going until you find the right one. And I always share this example because there might be someone else that may want therapy and realize they've had a bad experience. Maybe it was tellahalth. For me, it was tellahalth. And I remember that fast the the first experience. I'm like, I it's not for me. I I wouldn't do it, you know? Then um I second time I met someone in person and really cuz my wife sent me you know one day I break down crying as I become a father life was just life in and you know she says hey I think you might need to go more than than me cuz she was going for postpartum

[18:39]  so I go and this is my first time I'm like whatever what what do I have to lose right and I went there like a faucet just kind of told them everything that was kind of mentally going on. I'm a new father. Some of the things I was experiencing as a young man that I've, you know, all these things that we just swept under the rug.

[18:52]  Yeah.

[18:52]  And and really lashing out. One of the things that even had me thinking like that, Scott, to be very transparent, is that um one time I got so mad, right? And and I'm not that type of person to get mad, but my wife says, "Man, I almost didn't even know who you were.

[19:07]  You look like a monster."

[19:09]  And knowing me that that's not who I was. There had to be something bigger, right? Some there was a bigger issue. So, I remember going to this therapist and I only went Scott one time to this lady, but I advocate for her and I advocate for for therapist in general because it took that one time for me to feel so comfortable and like, wow, it's like almost like I was sitting across the per, you know, the uh the room from a friend. They wasn't judging,

[19:34]  nor were they telling me what I had to do. All they were doing was asking questions that made me think

[19:39]  and and realize I had the answers in me the whole time.

[19:42]  Sometimes it's just we need to be asked a certain way. Sometimes we just need that person to give us that tone um you know that that allow us to feel seen and heard in a room. So yeah, I'm with you, man. Is do we ever get away from that human element? I hope not. I yeah I think I think it's really going to be challenging to replicate um that human element because as smart as machines become, they're not going to have that same sense of what it is to uniquely be human. Um and to know the the true emotional depth of what it is to be human. Uh, and I really I appreciate you sharing that and I and I appreciate the fact that, you know, you were talking about how sometimes it doesn't have, you know, counseling or therapy doesn't have to be a long-term kind of experience. Some people, you know, hearken back to, you know, people being in, you know, psychoanalysis for years and years and years and years to learn about themselves. It doesn't necessarily have to be that at all. It can be a very brief interaction or or maybe just a few sessions where just being able to express yourself in a place that's non-judgmental, that you've got somebody that is open uh to hearing everything will be there to uh like you said, reflect back on some of the things that they heard you say. um and help you kind of explore some of those the avenues for uh you know working through some of that can can make all the difference in the world. And uh you know we look back at you know whether it's a a friend or a coach or a family member um we can look on you know as as somebody that was very helpful in us getting through a particularly challenging time. You know a counselor can do this can can help out in that regard as well. And I don't think we need to feel embarrassed or ashamed or guilty and going to get that level of support. I mean, we don't feel embarrassed about any other, you know, uh, thing that we're going through in our life, whether it happens to be our heart or our kidney or our liver. Um, you know, those are all parts of who we are. Well, our brain is part of who we are, too, right? Why why do we attach some sort of stigma or guilt um to just having conversations with somebody that might be able to provide some help and support and a little bit of guidance and advice and and then be off and running again.

[22:10]  Yeah. Know I I love it. I love that. Um another thing that you mentioned about just AI and technology, it would never have that life experiences that we have that we can share from. And I think that's what's so cool about it. And even as we continue to share these conversations to be very transparent and

[22:26]  people have to understand that we're all all human. We all have a story. You know, I'll tell you what, when I was I was sexually abused for so many years in my life and I did grow up until I was 20ome years old feeling like I would be judged

[22:38]  for sharing the story, right? And realizing no, actually as I share the story, not not only did it help me heal, it allows so many others to realize that they're not in it alone. and now so many others want to share their stories and and so many you know so I think what we do sometimes almost hold ourselves back from from really propelling into

[22:58]  maybe our purpose you know what I realize now Scott is that having real raw authentic conversations is such a game changer

[23:05]  because it could truly there could be one thing in a 30-minute conversation that someone walks away with and say man and for the rest of rest of their lives you may never see that person again but they stuck with that that seed you know that you planted. Now it's up to them to water it. It's up to other people to water it. But I do love it. I love that we h can have these conversations and I hope that people don't feel embarrassed to have these conversations cuz it's just life experiences. And I can imagine you line up 10 different people in a room and they can all tell you a story that was very heartbreaking that um that you would look and and get emotional about. You know, hell, I was watching a video and this Tik Tok man, I'm an emotional person, by the way. Uh but I was watching this video and it was this guy. his content is that he just meets people in random locations. So this person

[23:48]  was going into I think a pawn shop or something and he would just ask like hey can can I get like a dollar and he's just trying to see who's going to be kind, right? And and he hears a story and this lady I think she was going to a grocery store so he said can I get a strawberry and he's like I'm so hungry.

[24:03]  And then she's like yeah and he's like asking like hey where you going work? And she's like no you know I'm trying to look for jobs and all this other stuff and he eats the strawberry. He's like well I got something for you and he hands her $1,000.

[24:13]  Wow. not knowing what her situation was. Her situation, she's like, man, like I can't find work. I'm trying to buy diapers for my child. And there's a story behind it for him. He just thought he was doing something, you know, kind cuz she did something kind. But he made such a big difference. I mean, she fell on the floor and she just thanked God. And and when I see that, man, it goes to show we have to be authentic and and just be kind to people

[24:39]  because that matters as well.

[24:40]  Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, you know, the whole adage of, you know, everybody's going through something, you know, and if we just slow down and take the time to truly be present and interact, how much of a game changer that can be for that individual and for yourself. I mean, we all grow through those experiences. Um, you know, and it's better to give than to receive. I mean, there's all these different things that we can do to support one another. And I love what you were sharing about, you know, when when you're authentic and you're opening up and transparent about things that you're going through, you know, that's going to help, you know, that individual feel more comfortable, feel like they can open up, feel like they can have that they can express what's going on inside them. You have that conversation, even if you don't have another conversation with that individual, you've touched and changed that person's life. and not only that person's life, but when you stop and think about the ripple effects of that as well. When you help an individual, you're also helping all those people around that individual. When you're having that conversation with a young father who's got, you know, he's got children, you know, the by that father doing better, those kids are doing better, and that you can you can really have multigenerational impact. Um, and all of these ripple effects, you know, they're doing better than when they're going to work, they're feeling better. they're more confident, you know, so that the co-workers are benefiting. You start thinking about the exponential uh implication of when you make one change, one place, how that can really change trajectories in a lot of different ways.

[26:15]  You just this is a good conversation, Scott. I don't know if I expected the conversation to be this. I know it's going to be good, but this is some good stuff that hopefully people are really learning from. And I think another thing that I love from you is that you're leading through the limitations um in a world you know where the impact is real but the budget really matches the need to be quite frank. Do you have just so that other leaders may be able to kind of take this and implement it but do you have uh maybe a program that you pulled off with pennies and just passion that really should have

[26:45]  that shouldn't have worked but it did.

[26:47]  Yeah. I think you know one of the things that comes to mind for me is the fact that you know when in uh mental health community mental health in specific where we you know we take care of anybody that comes to our door so we don't turn anybody away. So whether a person has insurance doesn't have insurance low income you name it. Um so we have to do a lot uh with a little and unfortunately there's just not a lot of resources that are put in general into mental health. Um so we we just thrive on um and it's in our charter that we cultivate u a sense of creativity and resourcefulness you know in addition to the other things teamwork and other things but I think when you're put into a situation where you don't have all the resources that you need um to make it easy it is something that as a leader that you can tap into um part of our teamwork orientation is hey we all we got to come together. We got to figure out how to make this happen. We know the needs there. Um you you know and we lean into the purpose of what we're here for, what the mission is, of what we're trying to accomplish. And then it's like, okay, but it's not going to be easy. Um these are these are this is what we know we need. These are the resources that we have and uh we got to make something happen. And um and I think that that's, you know, an area where people thrive in because they they know that that need's not going away. that that need is really important and we just all have to figure out how to do it. So people bring the best uh that they've got of their creativity, their resourcefulness, their uh spirit of teamwork, their skills. Um and you know so we've you know we've created new programs that way. We've created opportunities to expand programs that way. Um, and sometimes when you're able to pull something off with just a little bit of money and you do something, you know, and thank thank God in heaven, a little bit more miraculous than people expected, then that can spur on people to say, "Hey, I want to get behind that team. That team is, you know, they're doing some really good things and they're doing it in a really resourceful way and using and being good stewards of what they have. I want to invest in that. I want to donate to that." And um so I think that those are the things that we try to cultivate wherever we possibly can. And sometimes you only can cultivate that when you're in a in an environment where you don't have the resources that you that you fully need.

[29:11]  Just dropping gems here, man. I'm sitting here like, "Yeah, this is You're right." Do do you ever feel you wake up in the mornings and think to yourself, "How did I get here?"

[29:21]  Yeah, I guess. Uh yeah, I I'm

[29:24]  in a good way. In a good way, too, right? Like, wow, God really blessed me.

[29:28]  Yeah. And no, I I really I wake up a lot feeling very blessed that um for the longest while I remember, you know, when I got I I took a little bit of time off between my bachelors and my masters. I was working on my masters full-time and and working full-time. Um and uh I remember very early on, I'm a young person, what am I, 24 years old, and one of the things I had to do is write a term paper on where I would love to see myself um in my career path. And um and I kind of, you know, I'm I wake up thinking that now 30 years ago or so that God's blessed me with the opportunity to see that vision realized. I mean, so I said 30 years ago, I'd love to be, you know, running or be a CEO of a of a large, you know, mental health organization that helps people in all these different ways. And um and he's blessed me with the opportunity to do that. So

[30:20]  wait a minute, Scott, you said that you cuz I love this. I love that you say this cuz I might bring this back as well. You said you're a young guy getting into the,

[30:29]  you know, field and you just put out there that, hey, one day I want to be CEO of the organization in this field. Is that correct?

[30:36]  Mhm.

[30:37]  Man, let me tell you something. I tell people, be mindful and careful what you put out there.

[30:41]  Yeah.

[30:41]  Cuz God will really bring it to you. That's

[30:43]  right. And and in that space, hey, one day, and you just saying that, I'll tell you what, I one day when I was younger, I told God that I wanted to give back. I I like, you know what? I would love to be a host and and you know, being able to just talk on the mic. Well, look what the hell I'm doing right here. Right. Yeah. Yeah. God would do this in in very mysterious ways. And I I think about it because I very early on and you know, I've been with my wife now 13 years, but when we were just boyfriend and girlfriends that, you know, she I say, "One day I'm going to get paid to speak and travel on somebody else's dime." And I've been able to live that, you know, but it was something that I just felt upon uh that was upon me. But realizing this is God just kind of instilling these these visions and these dreams in you and it's up to us to continue to chase them, you know, and that's that whole, you know, living um living with faith and not fear. You know, I think that's why sometimes people get held back from their their big dreams is because they have a fear of of all these things that someone might have told them. We bring this back earlier, Scott, when you had all this noise. Just imagine if you would have listened to every single person that had something negative to say,

[31:48]  you know, and it wasn't probably intentional. They they didn't want to hurt you. They didn't want to stop you from being

[31:52]  I think they were doing it because they were trying to protect me. You know, people were saying, "Hey, you know, because they're thinking from from a worldly standpoint, you know, this doesn't, you know, make sense to them in the world that they're seeing. But, you know, what we need to understand is there's a whole different world out there that uh that God sees. And you know, we might see, you know, the you we can't see around the corners. He can see around the corners. And if he's put something inside you, there's a reason that it's there. And he's just encouraging you to, you know, if he calls you just to follow, you know, and that's where the faith comes in, you know, is is acting when you can't see it. And um so if you just have the trust in him and you know, he just asks you to put one step in front of the other and let you know if he's going to bring you to it, he's going to bring you through it. And that's where you just you need need to trust and that's where the faith comes in. The world doesn't teach that. And the world's currency is a very different currency of treasure. So, you know, if you just keep your eyes on him and you follow him, he'll he'll lead you to where you need to be and where you he wants you to be.

[32:53]  You're 100% right, man. I I when I was building this business that I have now, and it was finances were drying up and it became very difficult and I was having to have that conversation. My wife's a stay at home mom. we got kids, we got a mortgage. And it's like I left my corporate job. I left what was comfortable. I left the, you know, that income that I was getting every month that was just paying everything. And um towards the end of the year, I remember telling her um money's drying up. I don't know what to do next. I didn't have a thought to go get another job. That wasn't in my mind. That wasn't part of the vision that that was instilled in me. And she said to me, Claire, as they always remember, she says, "God didn't bring us this far to quit." now did he?

[33:36]  Amen. That's right.

[33:37]  Right. And that was it. It was like, you're right. Like faith was the word that I was going with that whole year. And I had to continue to have faith even when things really got hard. Right. And I tell you, man, that having faith and fighting even through that

[33:53]  that I would say probably a couple of weeks later, there was a shift.

[33:58]  Right. Now you start to to see the clients. Now you start to see the income. and all because you stuck through with it. You know, a lot of times I'll give you another one. I um a gentleman told me one day,

[34:09]  God will bless your faithfulness, right? So when you're you're being faithful to him and he's blessing that faithfulness, you know, he's like never never promises it's going to be easy, but he's promises that he'll be through it with you through it all. And when you take that leap of faith and when you step forward, he blesses that.

[34:27]  100%, man. Oh, man. This is so good, man. for someone who's listening right now, uh, Scott, who's never supported a mental health organization, what's one step they can actually take today?

[34:36]  Sure. I mean, they can go to, um, online, they can search their local community mental health center that's right in their community. Um, there are mental health centers that are all around the country and um, and just kind of research them a little bit. And, uh, I'm sure that there's programs that they would be uh, I'm I apologize. I have my my I've been sitting too long.

[35:00]  Oh, there you go.

[35:03]  Um, yeah. So, if they're interested in uh supporting a local community mental health center, they can just go online, even probably put in their zip code and community mental health center. Um, and very likely they're going to have a not for-profit uh community mental health center in their area or in their region. And I think they'll probably see that they're doing an awful lot with without a lot of resources. uh there's probably programs that they could really get behind. Whether it's a children's mental health program, whether it's being out there working in the community, outreach programs, prevention programs, there's a lot of things that the the centers do and they can always benefit from, you know, any type of donation, no matter how small or how large, it can be very much appreciated. And a lot of the organizations will also have volunteer opportunities. So, there might be something that um that you can do to get involved. you know, most people have had some some type of connectivity to a mental health issue, whether it's themsel personally or their family. Um, so maybe a person's interested in coming in and talking to a group of individuals or maybe volunteering and coming uh to participate in a program on a monthly basis or something like that. So, there's a lot of opportunities.

[36:17]  So many people forget that there's those type of opportunities where you don't got to give. It's not always monetary. Sometimes it's just your time, an hour, two hours a week. It really makes a difference, right? And we kind of kind of talked about it so many times.

[36:29]  The other thing is just being an ambassador for opening the dialogue, you know, just not, you know, the more we can get around the water cooler and the dinner table and out in the community and in the faith communities and talk a little bit more openly about mental health and mental well-being and and uh and shattering the stigma around it is huge. Uh that's how we're going to live into, you know, a culture that is much is as embracing of mental health as any other form of healthcare.

[37:00]  Oh, yeah. I like that. And what do you want your leadership to leave behind? Not just for the staff though, but for the people that you actually serve.

[37:07]  Yeah. I you Well, I'm been uh trying to build up uh programs wherever the needs are um pretty much my whole career. So I definitely want to leave behind an opportunity for um you know my personal mission is you know that anybody that has a need in the area that I'm in um is going to be able to access those resources when they need it uh in a manner in which they can receive it. So whether they have income or no income or no uh insurance making sure that everybody has access to care. So, I've been trying to build out those resources for children and families and adults, you know, that struggle, whether it's a mental health struggle, substance use disorder struggle. Let's make sure that we're building all that's needed in the communities that uh that we have in our country. Um trying to help out with policy. you know, it's been something I'm I'm involved in a couple of national boards and we're trying to um assist in making sure that we've got really good public policy around how we attend to mental health and substance use disorder. Uh and then and then really making sure that uh we're as a leader you want to build up other leaders and that's been something I've been really passionate about as well is trying to um ensure that the leadership development and the skill development around leadership is um is you know kind of support those individuals feeling confident and comfortable in in raising up leaders behind them so that we're you know kind of passing the baton along the way to make sure that this is

[38:37]  uh something that can continue to not only just survive but also to thrive as far as helping uh people in need.

[38:44]  You just continue to amaze me, man. We start off with what you do as a CEO. Earlier you talked to me about what you're doing this weekend with the three and four year olds and how you're pouring into them. You're on the national board making sure there's policies that are really being implemented. Um you're a father like it really shows that there's true true passion in it. you know, a lot of the work that you do is is not because you're doing it for money, but you're doing it because as everything you mentioned, you want to make sure that you just kind of leave everything better than what you found it in a sense. So, I definitely appreciate that, Scott. And I ask you this last question, man. This is the blind question. This is the hot seat question. You've led for 34 years. What's that one decision you made with good intentions that still weighs on you because it just didn't land the way you hoped?

[39:25]  H with good intentions, but it didn't land the way that I hoped. Um, let me think.

[39:35]  Maybe a program that you implemented.

[39:37]  That's a really

[39:37]  maybe a policy.

[39:38]  Yeah, that's a really good

[39:41]  It's the last question, so I knew that it had to be a good question. So, cuz you've been so good through this all, we had to have that one final question.

[39:48]  It's a good one. I you know I I think one of the things that's been probably one of the tougher issues for me to be able to fully get my hands and arms around is uh 100% kind of employee engagement in uh you know advancing all the elements of what we're trying to do. So um so we've been working on it. I we're making we make a lot of progress in uh in making sure people feel 100% affirmed that we want to support them and grow them in the ways that they want to grow. And uh it's you that that's a little bit of a challenge. Sometimes there are, you know, when you run larger organizations, you've got a certain percentage of individuals that uh may be considered a little bit more of a job than a career. And I would really love to be able to try to engage as many people as possible in this as a as a long-term life career. Um, and uh, especially for more of the folks that are in more entrylevel positions. How can we try to encourage them

[40:55]  to uh, to want to be involved in this kind of long term?

[41:00]  I think it's a it's a really good problem to have um, to be quite frank because it's a challenging problem and a lot of people are experiencing it. So I feel if you knock that down, man, you you got it down to a tea. That just something that you can also start to share with others. Cuz in any organization, you see so much talent at times. You're like, man, you could really be good. But as you mentioned, a lot of times maybe they're just there because they're in school and they just need to kind of make some money. But we've also seen those people that go into those some organizations um from an entry level because they thought it was just a part-time job and then realizing, no, I really love this. And then, you know, they start to become CEOs of organizations. I've spoken to those type of leaders as well. So, yeah, I think Scott, you're on to something. I think it is. How do we continue to get those people to realize like this is a a great place to be. Maybe the money is is where maybe the money is a little bit off of what they think, but it's not always about the money. Right. We stop chasing the wrong P in this case, chase purpose, cuz you'll realize your cups are being filled more than money can ever buy.

[41:59]  Right. Right. Right. Yes.

[42:02]  I love it. Scott, where can people find you, man? Are you on LinkedIn? What can what's also if you can get the website for the organization?

[42:07]  Yeah, I'm on LinkedIn and uh you can look us up at uh David Lawrence Centers. Um and uh we're right here in Naples, Florida. Uh so you can uh look me up both ways.

[42:18]  All right. Well, I appreciate you, Scott, for all the time for being just an amazing leader. And I can imagine we'll have another conversation at some point cuz we could have really went off and talked about faith. We could have really talked about leadership. There's so much that you actually bring to the table. But we thank you for taking the time to really just pour into us today and give us so much insight when it comes to what you do and also mental health um and and how we're really changing the game just one story at a time.

[42:41]  Scott, thank you so much.

[42:43]  Thank you so much.

[42:44]  Thank you guys. If you guys are still watching, don't forget to like, subscribe, and comment because that's really how conversations continue to get out and people really get to be impacted by real authentic conversations like me and Scott today. My name is Drain. This is Scott. We'll catch you guys in the next one. Latest.