How Ike Muzikowski Turned Down Wall Street to Transform a High School in Chicago

[0:00]  We are doing something that's unique and uncommon. And we're not celebrating kids for excelling in a passion. We're celebrating them for pursuing a passion. If you like to rap, if you like to play softball, I don't care if you're on the JV team. I don't care if you strike out. If you're out there, heck yeah. Like, let's let's get get pumped for you. So, I think cherishing each moment is important. Um, and then letting kids know like, hey, you're what what you find as a passion or a hobby is valuable. I love the the quiet girl who doesn't talk to anyone, who paints or draws little sketches. Putting her in the weekly newsletter and celebrating her and saying, "Hey, this is just as as important as a kid who can make a half court shot.

[1:00]  Welcome back to the Heart and Hustle podcast. Ike, I got to start with this, man. Wall Street or the nonprofit world? You had both doors open. What made you say, "Nah, I'm going back home to lead a high school instead of actually chasing that finance life." Uh, I grew up I grew up in uh a family that was always doing ministry. Um and so one thing that was always ingrained in me since I was little was this quote from Mother Teresa. If life is not live for others, it is not worthwhile. Um and my dad worked in an office downtown. And so we would always be in there uh hanging out, chilling. I got seven brothers and sisters. We're all little running around. But that that picture with Mother Teresa kind of looking down over us was always something that stuck out to me and is ingrained in my mind. So, uh, my biggest excitement for choosing

[1:48]  between, hey, working at a high school that my parents started, that I went to with hundreds of kids that I know and in a community I believe in, that was so much more attractive and compelling. Um, than working a Wall Street job. Um, obviously, Wall Street pays more. Um, Columbia University is a a hub of kind of just financial prowess, ambition.

[2:13]  It's it's New York City and so everyone's chasing Goldman. Everyone's chasing Morgan Stanley and uh it's it's tough. It's it's a it's cutthroat kind of dog eat dog uh sort of reality out there. And uh Columbia kids are very ambitious. So there's not a lot of people who uh chose to go and work in the nonprofit space who are graduating from Ivy League schools. Just not it's just not a thing.

[2:36]  Um, so I was I think I I wanted to be absolutely determined to enjoy what I do. Uh, I'm I'm a people person. I love working with kids. I love helping other people. Uh, I think that I I wake up every single day feeling exhilarated. Um, hey, today could be the best day ever. You never know. And and there's an excitement for it. The kids are waiting for you. You're waiting for them. I have I have the most fun in this building every day. And it's just because I'm I'm a fun person. People say, "Oh, you your job seems like a lot of fun." Like my job is not fun. I am fun. Like, and I'm I'm going to have fun every single day.

[3:15]  But I love building up a culture and energy so that kids who might be feeling depressed, who might be feeling lonely, who might be feeling isolated, they can they can get that little extra edge of comfort. And maybe that helps them get them get them through the day. I love it. And for those who don't know, I got the man, the man, the myth, the legend himself, the break dancer, the dancer, Mr. Ike. Man, this guy is the president of Chicago Hope Academy. Um, he's also the principal of Chicago Hope Academy.

[3:42]  He's out here really making a serious impact in education and leadership and in kids' lives. So, I really would love to kind of just dive. What's the heart behind what you do, man? Like you talk about fun, you talk about great leadership, you talk about leaving what could have been a a a great maybe money-making opportunity, but your goal was not about the money, it was about the impact. What's the heart behind what you do, man? Uh, so it's a I work at a Christian high school. Um, and so I grew up in in a a household that was very big on faith and spiritual connection. And uh I wasn't always the best at it. I wasn't the one who was necessarily ready to hop in a pulpit or preaching on a street corner, anything like that. Even when I meet people, I I

[4:30]  wouldn't be outspoken about my faith. I would just kind of do the right thing and you people could sort of see, hey, they'll know that you're a Christian by your love, how you treat other people. Um and so I it's pretty pretty cool to understand like, hey, tomorrow's not promised. And so don't don't worry about tomorrow. Uh Jesus kind of talks about that in Matthew, but knowing that today is all we have. And even in a school year, you're going to lose, kids are going to graduate, new kids will come in, kids will transfer out. It's like, hey, this crew we have here together this school year, we'll never be together again.

[5:04]  We'll since we since we have this group, let's love each other now because this group is special. Um and so being able to build community is really tough. It's not easy to build community. and I I pride myself on the community that we've built here at Hope Together. I'm kind of the the heartbeat of it sometimes driving things forward, but I got a lot of good people around me who help uh lift the spirits of the kids and and the kids they bring the energy. It kind of creates this cycle of of love, forgiveness, passion, excitement, and uh yeah, I think one of the greatest feelings in the world is the feeling you belong. And so we've tried to make hope a place of belonging where a kid could feel feel like they're special because they go here. Not because they're a star athlete, not because they win the state

[5:50]  championship, not because they're the valictorian, just because they're one of us. And that's in high school. It's easy to be lonely. Uh especially postcoid. Um people live on their phones. We're all alone but together. Alone together is such a a sad concept. And so we have the kids turn their phones and hey, love one another. to talk to each other, build relationship. That's I think I I think it's special. So, I'm excited to build community every day.

[6:18]  I You talk about community. You talk about fun. You talk about everything that you know what you try to bring to the school. Let's talk about it, man. I'm I'm sitting here and I'm prepping for this podcast. You're on Good Morning America. You're going viral on TikTok. You I mean, who knew that Ike had these dancing skills, man? I'm over here, you know. Look look look. I I got it, bro.

[6:37]  Where do you get these dancing skills, bro? Hey, I love it, bro. Yes. Where does this come from, man? Always been a dancer? No, I didn't I didn't really start getting into dancing until high school. Um, I was always really good athlete. I very coordinated, have really good balance. Um, but in high school, I was 2007 was the fall of my freshman year.

[7:06]  So, like the Soulja Boy dance had just come out. Okay. Or uh lean with it rock with it. uh by my okay junior year it was the cat daddy the douge the you're a jerk I don't know you're and those those sort of dances were it's almost like Tik Tok now is the revival of that where songs are sort of explaining the dance that you do or uh crank that Batman people don't even remember crank that Batman like oh those those were popular when I was in high school and so you would just kind of see friends doing it the uh We had transitioned probably seventh eighth grade year. People were transitioning from MySpace to Facebook. I think I got a Facebook my freshman year of high school, sophomore year high school. And then from there

[7:53]  it's like, oh, you can upload videos onto this YouTube platform. Yeah. And we're sort of figuring these out. Snapchat was there maybe my senior year. Um, so just as as it became more popular socially, I I thought that was pretty cool and I got excited to to learn some things. But in on the west side of Chicago, there's this style of dance.

[8:16]  Well, Southside, West Side Chicago called footworking, like a rapid footwork movements. Um, I was never very great at it, but if you learn the the simplest basic steps, you can take your turn for eight seconds in the circle and then hop out. So, uh, I think the the teach me how to douge dance is was always just my favorite one to do. And I would just when I got to college, I always viewed myself as just an average D. Like I'm not actually a bad dancer.

[8:43]  Like cuz I know people who are legit in battles performing. I thought, oh, I don't I don't got any sauce. But you go to Columbia University where you're with a bunch of validictorians, kids who are a little less rhythmically inclined, a little bit more academically focused. And then you become the most cool person there because you can dance. That that woke up my confidence a lot because I think I had grown up in a bubble where athletic talent, uh, dance, rhythm, hiphop was our community was so saturated with people who had different skill sets in those areas that I thought like, all right, I'm I'm just a scrub. Like, I'm an average kid. But when you realize like, oh no, everyone I knew who knew how to dance was actually like really really good at dancing. So it had I had to go to college with a bunch of kids

[9:31]  who looked like me but didn't grow up like me um who didn't have the rhythm. And I was like, "Oh, this is I am cool. I am Yeah, I am good at dancing." Listen, when I'm seeing you break dancing, jumping off walls, bro, I'm like, "Oh, oh, I got moves, man. I got moves." the whole time thinking like he must have like a a background in break dancing or dancing, but you're telling me no, man. I just kind of I love it. I I just It was always a good time. I've kind of learned as I went and now you're here. You're Why do you love to do it with the kids? Do you feel like that's their language? Like you're you're speaking the kids' language when you're out there dancing with them. Yeah. Same as I play soccer with the boys varsity team. I'll play basketball. I'll uh pass the ball a little bit with kids if they see a rugby ball.

[10:17]  Um, I think a lot of students think school is boring. School sucks. It's just how kids think and it's it's unfortunate. I I don't have empathy for that student. I can have compassion, but I don't have empathy because I learned to love to read when I was little. My mom uh made that the most exciting thing you can do in the world is is sit by yourself and and read and learn and explore and be creative. in that there was this scintillating enticement towards reading and knowledge acquisition. A lot of kids um growing up on the west side of Chicago, south side of Chicago didn't necessarily hear two million words before they turned two. Uh literacy isn't something that's hyper celebrated. Um there's lots of systematic historical kind of impacts

[11:05]  that affect that. But then also socially, culturally, um when when you're in neighborhoods where schools are so low performing, the the celebration and expectation for academic excellence isn't common. Uh it's not unheard of, but it's definitely not the the the commonplace sort of expectation. episode. I think that being the person in charge of all the teachers who facilitate the learning, if I can have uh some relational capital with the students, a lot of that comes through dancing, uh enjoying sports. Lots of times people think, oh, we're student athletes. I know a lot of kids who are athlete students and because they play sports, they come to school. And so, you have to

[11:53]  you can't be a naive optimist. You have to be a realistic support system. You have to meet kids where they are. Understand where they're from, understand where they're not from. Um, I don't just walk up to random kids and start dancing in front like, "Look at me. I like Tik Tok, too." It's because that's that's forced. Um, but I I think a lot of people think me doing dances with kids is pretty fun because they don't expect that. Usually the principal is someone who's a bit more stiff, uh, a rigid facilitator of behavioral regulation in schools. I'm I'm very playful. I'm kind of a prankster. Uh I like to pull little pranks and tease people, create laughter. I think laughter is so good for the soul. So I I think it dancing, sports, a lot of kids are

[12:41]  really good at that and enjoy that. They find that entertainment fun. Um and I'm trying to transition that same level of energy and attraction towards reading. I just started a book club when uh book club when Black History Month started. I like the white guys starting a Malcolm X book club. Come through kids. And so we got about 20 kids who are coming to it and uh not everyone reads it every time. But if you buy cookies, some delicious cookies from Ferrar's bakery. Uh if you buy the cookies and you give the summary of the book and then read an excerpt and then make it a discussion, kids be like, "Okay, the story of Malcolm X is important. All right, we can learn something and apply it to our lives. But you say everyone go and read these 60 pages over the weekend, they're like you, you got me faded. Like I'm not about I'm not about to do that. So

[13:30]  significant learning can happen when there's significant relationship. And I think you build relationship through fun moments, not serious moments. Hey, real quick. If you enjoying the podcast, we first want to say thank you. And we also just want to give you a little insight of what we're up to at Francis. Some don't even realize that we're working with organizations to help them use AI to create that real human communication experiences. Whether that's actually supporting your your families, those patients or the entire community. We're actually creating tech that connects.

[14:01]  Check it out. Francis.ai. I love it, man. I think you're one of a kind. um just seeing you and the way that you are with your kids um the way you are as an individual it's almost what you see out of a movie because you are right you know when you got principles and it's not like they're not doing their job but you don't see them as much very interactive with the students and not only I would say from the student perspective the teachers that are getting to see like this is our principal like you know you're really setting the standard now the teachers can also know that they can have a little bit of fun without you coming at them like, "Oh, wait a minute. We supposed to be doing such and such curriculum." Because it is is what makes people want to just continue to be engaged, continue to want to come to school. Because for so many young kids, school is is their outlet from from

[14:50]  home. You know, they feel comfortable. They feel the most safe. Especially myself, I love to go to school. Not because I was doing my work, but my friends are there. I had good teachers. I really felt myself. I felt very comfortable. And at times you talk about, you know, Chicago probably not one of the best neighborhoods. Anytime I hear about Chicago, you hear the guns, the fights, the, you know, all these different things, but here you are, Ike, just making sure these kids understand no matter where you come from, no matter where you at in your life. You come to school, have fun. I'll be the standard of that. So, I I truly like it. And I really want to kind of go back to what you mentioned that this is really familyun ministry, per se, right? Yeah.

[15:30]  Did you always see yourself stepping into this leadership role or did you realize that this is what you should be later on in life, maybe after college? Uh, I always I really bought into what my parents were doing. They started the school in seventh grade. Um, it was burst out of a little league program. Uh, so they ran a baseball little league uh on the west side. They ran a drug rehab uh on the west side in in southern Illinois. They had a farm about three hours away. Uh so they would find gentlemen who are struggling with that and need to be sent away for a couple months of uh disconnection. Uh probably not the most scientifically grounded. It's the 90s.

[16:12]  You're trying to trying to help people in tough situations. Um and so in that sense of like, hey, I grew up knowing my parents were working with men who had made big mistakes in their lives in their 20s, 30s, 40s trying to get sober. And then they're working with kids ages seven, six through 15 who are uh playing in the baseball little league in the summertime and then going to tough high schools or being pulled into the influence of whether it's the street life or could be drugs, could be crime, could be gangs. And that's just very common place in in isolated pockets in the city. Uh but that's the pocket where where we were. And so you don't don't necessarily know any better. And if you

[17:00]  can't see it, you can't be it. And it's not enough to say, "Hey, pull yourself up by the bootstraps." And it's like, "Well, I go to a failing school. My parents didn't go to college. I don't have a lot of money. Am I just supposed to shrug my shoulders and go to university and be the next president of the United States?" It's it's unrealistic a lot of times to set that expectation. And so kids need mentors. They need community. They need church. They need uh a school counselor.

[17:26]  They need friends who are uh on the right path. They need friends whose parents believe in them doing the right thing. So uh in that sense, I I I grew up knowing that ministry was important and that there there's a lot of a high expectation for us to put others before ourselves. Like don't don't only count your own needs, but also count the look to the interest of others. Uh was just important for our family. And so to to be compassionate to the point of inconvenience was an expectation. Um and so when I when I went to Hope, I was homeschooled until we got there and we started high school.

[18:05]  I thought it was so cool to be in class to to help students with homework to uh help my parents build a school doing demolition um working with volunteers. So, I thought that the the gargantuan effort, blood, sweat, and tears that went into the place. Other people don't have that that level of equity. Like you guys, I we I love all our teachers. They're coming and they're serving here. But watching how much my family poured into it makes it a lot more special. You have owner's eyes. That's if if your parents ran a restaurant, you get it. If if your parents ran their own business and half of it was run out of your house, you get it. if you're still confused like all right you you grew up with uh either less of an entrepreneurial bent or some privilege and securities but my parents were always pouring into others so I

[18:54]  just thought it was so cool and then studying economics um was the kind of path sort of finance direction it leads you to in New York City but in high school a lot of teachers are saying hey you could come run this place hey you you're you were meant for something like this you were built for something like this uh not saying they prophesied it by any means, they were just picking up on my maybe generosity or or excitedness in and helping others. So once I got the first offer, like all right, check mark that box. You're good enough in in the world standards and society standards to go and get a highpaying job in Wall Street.

[19:33]  Now I can just come back to Hope and really enjoy what I do and and try to build upon what my my parents have laid the foundation for. Yeah, man. continuing to carry the legacy that they've created um and and doing it at high standards for sure. And Hope Academy, man, is not your typical high school. Can you tell us a little bit what makes Hope Academy actually different than other high schools? Yeah, so we're the only non Catholic uh private Christian high school 9 through 12 in the city. Um and so it's it's not a school it for low-income students, but all of our students are relying on financial aid. And so the the mission of the school is to provide an affordable high quality Christian educational experience uh for kids west, south, north sides of Chicago. So most

[20:21]  private schools charge what it costs cost $15,000 to fund the school, 20 some private schools cost $45,000. Um the the most elite ones and saying should should private schools be only for rich kids? Say no. Should they be predominantly just for white and Asian kids? No. But they are. That's the reality. There's not necessarily an intentional discrimination there. It's just based on where people are living, how they're growing up. Uh over these last couple generations, uh a lot of kids coming from the west and south side of Chicago, tough neighborhoods, don't have resources to go to private schools.

[21:05]  And then the schools in their neighborhoods are usually underperforming. So you can kind of feel trapped and and it's to the sense that education is not the great equalizer. It's the great solidifier. You will be a product of your environment if your parents didn't go to college and you're going to an underperforming school. It's not going to be your ticket out. So that's why kids think, "Hey, I need to be able to to dunk a ball, to rap, to to have some extreme talent in this entertainment industry." And that's unfortunate. That's a a travesty. And so our goal, we're not the solution to Chicago's educational system, but we're the choice and selection for our 300 kids. And so we think that uh private school with smaller class sizes, um a focus on

[21:54]  character is is essential. And then knowing that we're not just a means to an end where kids could be the first in their family to attend college affordably. Like hope can be an ends in itself because with tomorrow not being promised, you never know when when could be your last day. You could get hit by a bus, you could get shot, you could um have a heart attack, an asthma attack, you never know. So if we can introduce kids to Christ and and grow their spiritual um walk, that's that's the win. We're not waiting for something else. Like that's the joy we get to have every day is being in community together knowing that like hey Jesus died on the cross to save us and we that should be celebrated. My dad always said you didn't become Christian to be miserable.

[22:39]  Usually people think Christians like man that's that school is boring or it's not lit in the hallways or this this and that. So I try to make sure that Christianity could even be something that is fun, engaging, exciting. I'm g bring him back in PowerPoint Jesus man. Yeah. Like that it you don't you don't have to be uh tired or not cool and and you don't also have to like get a Jesus tattoo on your shoulder. You don't you don't need to go too be too extra. Um but we think that hey a a Christian education um even just celebrating Judeo values and civic life. We have a couple students who are Muslim here. We have students who are agnostic here. Uh families as well who who just want their kids to be in a safe environment. A lot of schools in tough

[23:27]  areas of Chicago are you've got uh gang affiliations. You got kids who have access to guns who are involved in uh different criminal activity and it's sad that that those kids are being pulled into that or pushed into that. Um so we want to be countercultural in that sense. We don't have locks on the lockers. We don't have metal detectors.

[23:49]  Um, sometimes that's not doesn't play to our advantage every single day, but we're trying to create a notion of, hey, you tell the truth. Kids will say, "Oh, I'm not a snitch. I'll snitch." Like, listen here, you clown. At Chicago Academy, you tell the truth and you hold each other accountable. We if a kid does come and t, hey, if a kid's vaping in the bathroom, I don't want to catch him to expel him. I want to be able to have a better understanding of the student.

[24:17]  Hey, why are you doing this? And it's not, oh, I'm dealing with the trauma. My life. No, you're doing it because you think it's fun because you want to get high. Like, we don't need to make this a a college essay. We are the victim. What's like you're just being bad. You you just want to do what you think is enjoyable and fun, but we still want to have those conversations. And then you want to leave the 99 for the one, but you also can't let the one start bringing down the other 99 because then that's unhealthy for culture. We also have to respect the institution. So our kids are not perfect and I'm absolutely not perfect either. But we're uh we're trying to do something that's unique. We are doing something that's unique and uncommon. And we're not celebrating kids for excelling in a passion. We're celebrating them for pursuing a passion.

[25:04]  If you like to rap, if you like to play softball, I don't care if you're on the JV team. I don't care if you strike out. If you're out there, heck yeah. Like let's let's get get pumped for you. So, I think cherishing each moment is important. Um, and then letting kids know like, hey, you're what what you find as a passion or a hobby is valuable. I love the the quiet girl who doesn't talk to anyone who paints or or draws little sketches. Putting her in the weekly newsletter and celebrating her and saying, "Hey, this is just as as important as a kid who can make a half court shot." So, I agree. I agree.

[25:42]  Inclusivity is important. I like that. I love that. I love that you it's not about just sports for you. It's not about the dancing. It's not about entertainment because there's so many different ways out of these situations that they're in. You talk about artists, what she can actually do, right? She who knows, she could be a graphic designer for for Apple, for a Google, and you've given her that that just push. You're so good. Look at you highlighted here. What does that do for the mind? Starts to spark all these interests. So, I love that you think further than just the basics that every school, you know, thinks about. I'm a part of a back of my old high school and we have all these foundations that focus on football number one, right? Football is that number one thing everyone goes to school for. Uh they go to all the games, all the busy business happens football. Then you got basketball, but what happens to the kids in chorus? What happens to the

[26:29]  kids, you know, in band that could also have a phenomenal career in that? What happens to the kids in robotics? You know, we're moving into a space of uh of innovation. Why can't those kids be highlighted? But what's really interesting is that this school doesn't just focus on academics, career development, mentorship, faith. You guys do things like you've taken your kids to go volunteer at the Special Olympics. Like what was the idea behind that? Yeah.

[26:56]  So it's it's not about you is I just think a a great phrase and mentality for hey, look out for one another. My dad always said when I was little, hey, the best place to hit a bully is in the mouth. Like, look out for the underdog. Take care of a kid who's um who's maybe being picked on or not as cool, whatever cool means. Um like look how I look. I got like like my Forest Jordans on. Like look how uncool I look. Like I'm the coolest person in this building. And it's like, hey, if you wear I'm wearing stuff like this.

[27:33]  Like I think I always want to Sometimes I put on a three-piece suit and I look sharp with my lemon pepper steppers and it's like, okay, this guy's got his act together. And sometimes I look kind of like people like, "Oh, you look like a goofball." Like you you look like a clown. Um so but in that sense of we wear uniforms. The purpose of uniform is uh uniformity to to be one. It's not singularity but wholeness um is a goal there. But for for inclusivity, we don't have a a special education program at our school. Um we have some students who have some learning deficits, some IEPs, 504 plans, and we navigate that pretty well with a small class sizes um and after school supports, study halls, peer tutoring, things like that. But um during COVID, uh Special Olympics Chicago, they start operating out of our

[28:23]  gym. We have a so we have a school for 300 kids but a athletics facility for 15,000 athletes use it each year. So, Special Olympics has dozens of events there and they do it during the day um while the rest of students are in school and the Special Olympians they're some are seven years old, some are 45 and so it's a whole range of uh generations represented and during COVID a lot of volunteers stopped going to volunteer.

[28:53]  they canceled on them. Said, "Hey, CO wor" worried everyone. I get people had different interpretations. Um, I was like, not a super big vaccine guy, but I was like, "Put two shots in my arm so I could be with my kids. I want to be with the kids. I don't care what this does to me 20 years from now."

[29:09]  I was like, "I'm in here with these kids." So, yeah. Uh, once I got the vaccine, it was like, "All right, can we have kids coming back to school?" Chicago was shut down like New York. Like, it was um I didn't see the kids for a couple months. And so in the fall of 2020, as the volunteers weren't showing up to help with Special Olympics, they called us and said, "Hey, we don't need to use the facility, no volunteers are coming, and you need dozens of volunteers because lots of one-on-one supports for whether kids uh in a wheelchair or cereal pausy or some kids are wearing headphones because of the noise around them. You need lots of hands on deck." And we're like, "Oh, you're not. No, you don't need to cancel. Like, we just won't have school.

[29:48]  All our kids will go volunteer." And so we'd send about like 75 kids. Um and we did that for weeks, like couple days, uh sometimes two, three times a week for a couple months. Uh and then we went to Soldiers Field and clapped them in for their ceremony and we won like volunteers of the year uh with Special Olympics and it's and you have to teach kids kids who are who don't necessar who don't have someone in their family um with Down syndrome or or haven't had access to working with people whose uh minds work differently than ours or or whose bodies are functioning in different ways can be uncomfortable around that. And our kids are 14, 15, 16. And you have to teach them, hey, you don't you don't tease. You don't you don't need to have a heaviness of heart

[30:36]  of kind of worry on how you interact with a student who's different than you. You need to put on a smile and and lean into that discomfort. If you're feeling nervous, you just got to do it scared. And you got to believe that this is special. And by the end of the service, we're seven, eight hours, you're watching your kids be just different humans. um because you've you've evoked and elicited a sense of compassion from within them that they didn't have access to before to to love someone that uh you don't know and and you're essential. If you see a Jim, little Jim has his cerebral pausy and he's got the volleyball in his lap and we've got Tai. It's like all right well you got to go grab the volleyball and what do I do now? like launch it over the volleyball net and then look at

[31:24]  him and start jumping and cheering. You see Jim starts to shake and like, oh, that's that's what we're doing. And it's not, oh, my life is better than his life or his life is harder than my life. The mentality we teach is that their desire to celebrate sport is just as important as ours. So, let's celebrate that and let's let's buy into this moment and make it special. So, I I think that's super cool that we want our kids to volunteer, require them to volunteer.

[31:54]  Um, selfishness is so accessible in this generation. These iPad kids uh don't don't have as as many opportunities as we did growing up to to think about community service. So getting off your iPhone or iPad and leaving Tik Tok and Instagram and actually giving your time to someone else is unfamiliar to most Gen Z kids and it's embarrassing, shameful. I watch kids not look adults in the eye is is one thing.

[32:25]  Ignore adults when they're talking to you. I watch kids do that all the time. I'm like, "Oh my goodness, you you were you were not raised right." Like the parents No part the parents today are millennials. Yikes. Yeah. Can you believe that? Like the parents today are millennials. Oh my goodness. Like listen, I'm I'm one of those parents. So I get it. When I'm talking to my daughter and she's four and she's looking like this, but I'm looking at her and I say, "Excuse me, I need eye contact." Or when her mom's talking to her and she just, "No, no, excuse me. I need to go look at your mom in her face.

[33:00]  She's talking to you." Right. It it is very true because people they got the TV, they got all these distractions and are we reinforcing the respect you know what it actually looks like and not only that man long term it helps out because we have to listen to understand not listen to respond you know so are we really listening to what is going on because I want you to understand not because I want to be this just a dad but I really want you to understand what's going on here like this this is life you know and one of the biggest things I've learned is that we're going to spend so many years just teaching these kids. Um, we're not going to just wait till they're 18 and teach them about life.

[33:38]  We're teaching them about life since out of the wound, you know? So, it's so important because then it sometimes it becomes too late. They get to to your school, Ike, and and now you're having the situation where you're trying to talk to somebody and they're not looking you at the face, but it's not really their fault, you know? It's the upbringing. So, we got to try to, you know, uh, turn that a little bit like, hey, I understand that maybe you don't want to listen to me, but I I do need the respect of of just looking at me, you know, because that's what the respect looks like. Um, so I I really want to highlight something, man, just because that we got so much to cover, and I know time is right now so precious. You're the president of the school, the principal, and you're still talking to me, but you were 26 years old when you took leadership, which which is kind of crazy. I don't know any other 26 years old that became a president at that time. Was there a time that you felt like, oh man, I wasn't really ready for

[34:27]  this moment in leadership? Yeah, it's right right away. Um, we had a lot a big turnover, a big transition when I stepped into the role. Uh, about twothirds of our teachers left, about half the admin. So we had tons of rookies in the space, some with different ages, but some who had teaching experience before, but everyone was new to the building. And so I didn't necessarily feel well equipped to uh guide all the uh curriculum development, teacher evaluations.

[35:04]  Uh there's there's just so much to be done that experience uh like effectiveness favors those with experience. It's just easier a second time around. Uh and being a rookie principal at 26 working with teachers who are 30 who think they should be the principal instead of me or someone who's 45 is like who is this? I could be your dad, bro. Like calm down. Um it was it was it was very humb I I didn't slice a humble pie every night like all right just the but I learned from my mentor in graduate school uh I got my master's education from Harvard and came right in hope doing it from there and even at Harvard I was like man these other people in this program are all 30 35 years old 40 they've got two master's

[35:52]  degrees under their belt they've been assistant principles before I was like I'm three years out of college I'm just I'm happy to be here. Uh I think I got in because I test very well. I'm pretty good at standardized tests. Uh but the the the worry um lessened as I talked with a mentor who said, "Hey, in a school you need three there's three stakeholder groups.

[36:16]  The parents, the teachers, and the kids. You can have two of them aligned with you, locked in with you, you'll be all right." And so with a bunch of new staff, I was like, "Hey, I got the kids. I got the parents. So, my my growth area was being able to help the teachers a bit more and that wasn't my forte. Um, and you got to be as a as a leader of the principal, if you don't feed the teachers, they'll eat the students. And so, it's not enough to um to be someone who's got the energy, having fun with the kids. You have to pour into the teachers that you can have a trickle down economical experience. Um, and so by the end of that year, probably in April, I was able to hire hire on a dean of academics who could completely focus on the grading, the lesson planning, the support with

[37:05]  teachers, finding different resources, uh, empowering department heads. So you I you can only do so much. So I I wanted to lean into my strengths and that's so much more with culture, behavior, um, and mentalities. But the the spirit behind academic excellence, consistency, uh discipline, um that that was I I made sure, hey, I have to hire someone on to support me in that area. Uh because as as a principal of a private school, you're not just the traditional principle you see is making sure all the grades, the curriculum, everything's streamlined, efficient, meeting standards to the state, aligning certain preps with ACT style problems. Um I'm like, hey, I got to raise $5 million

[37:53]  with my dad so school doesn't shut down and co's coming and a lot of donors are not thinking about giving as much as they would have. So, uh I think I think my uh toughest moment was reading a a post someone posted on indeed.com uh just kind of grilling me like a cheeseburger. Like this is the you're the charlatan of the worst kind. You're you don't care about these kids, just your family's legacy. You don't have this experience. And it kind of it kind of hurt my feelings and I was like, man, that was hurtful. But again, do it anonymously. You're like, "All right, put your name at the bottom of this."

[38:32]  And there there's there are some clever lines in there, but it was there was a Sudin proverb that says, "The elephant does not stumble when walking on thorns." Um, and so like, hey, there if you're doing some things right, if you're doing a ton of things wrong, if you're in a position of leadership, people will hate on you. People will point out your shortcomings. Um, they say it's not the critic who counts that famous, it's the man who's actually in the arena. Come COVID time, man. It's the critic who counts. You're everyone's got a Facebook comment. Everyone everyone wants to tear someone down. You like ingest positivity by highlighting the shortcoming of others. Um, I like, "Oh, you're small." Like, "Oh, you're you're petty." So, I had I had to I had to be humble in different ways and kind of let that sink in and then grow from

[39:22]  it. And so then I I sort of started to get like, hey, a thicker skin. And then Oscar Wild, I love his quote of um the only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about 100%. So it's like, hey, I'm I'm out here. I know I'm I know I'm doing good things. I'm not the best, but I I'm actually pretty good. I'm I'm good at what I do. Um but I I had to understand like, hey, not everyone's going to be a fan of my style. introverts, type B personality, systems people cannot stand working with me, dude. Like they think I'm so disorganized because I'm all over the place, excited for the next idea. Uh, but they they help make the school run where you need that yin and yang to to be effective. And so the greatest diversity is diversity of opinion, of

[40:09]  work style. I think that's so helpful. Let's be honest, the best leaders are not the smartest in the room and they're not the best in the room. They're the best at leadership. So they find the team. you found a team that really works for you, allows you to highlight a lot of your fores, which is just interaction, community building. Um, you talked about having the relationship with the kids. Huge, right, from that level. It's such a huge thing because now they feel more comfortable when something does happen to even have that conversation with Ike. Um, you know, long term. The parents, that's also huge. Parents also want to make sure that the kids are in a safe place. can only imagine that you you create that that safetiness within the school and for the parents for their kids. So, I think it's dope, man. And I really want to kind of pivot to something else before we we lose some time here. We're

[40:56]  also in a space of AI innovation where and I last time we mentioned you're not really using it so much for the kids. I think you're using it just kind of on the back end for yourself a little bit. What's something in tech that you could actually maybe maybe school or education can actually benefit from down the line when it comes to AI?

[41:14]  for AI. AI that's a tougher uh space for me when I think about AI accelerating efficiency infinitely. Um you can accomplish so much more so much faster. But when you're working with kids, they still need to learn things um for for themselves, for their for their own mind to grow, for their own development. And an early introduction to AI without a critical mass of content knowledge, critical thinking skills, intelligence, and exposure uh is detrimental. If if you introduce kids to Chat GBT and AI at age 12, they'll never

[42:05]  know what it's like to open up the book, read the whole sentence, you're just teaching them how to try to cheat quickly, and they won't they won't even necessarily know what the look fors are from an adult who's going to recognize that they're cheating. Um, if you're just reading summaries of books, you've never experienced the the complexities and completeness of a story from from cover to cover. If you're only using a calculator, then you you don't really appreciate that four cars full of three people is 12 12 of us driving to the beach.

[42:48]  that in that in that spirit behind you need to have a critical mass of exposure. And so I I'm not a big fan of AI for kids. Um, when it comes to high school, if you're testing in the 90th percentile, 80th percentile, if you enjoy learning and you're trying to let AI give you access to success um, in an innovative sense, I can celebrate that.

[43:18]  kids who are in the computer program and kids into an architecture and design but there's no one when it when it comes to reading and writing AI shouldn't be uh celebrated in schools creating original content whether it's like hey let's write a poem sit down and think flex your muscles um if if a kid's trying to shoot a three-point shot and he wants to make five out of 10 of them that'd be a big accomplishment shooting 50% but if you give him a shooting machine and the shooting machine's doing it for him and he's just putting the ball into it like oh look you made 50%. Like he's literally just putting into a machine.

[43:58]  There's that's not impressive. But when it comes to writing papers or people like oh why are you mad that I'm using chat GBT or why are you frustrated that I'm going about it this way? You would never celebrate a kid putting a ball into a machine and the robot making a half court shot. like that's not why would you give a kid credit to that? So, in that sense, um I'm not a big fan of AI in schools. Um a lot of our kids are coming from public schools.

[44:26]  Um and so we're we're doing a little bit of a catchup their freshman sophomore year. Um and understanding that reading out loud, a lot of kids haven't read books out loud before. A lot of kids haven't read a book on their own. um a lot of kids retaking pre-alggebra class and it's it's not to something to be embarrassed about. If you don't get better at pre-alggebra now, then you're going to have the same ability level when you're 85. And so it's important for us to to set standards for kids and have them complete homework assignments, do things in class so that we know their their their mental effort is being activated. Um, and then also I think hands-on learning is important. We've

[45:13]  started a trades pathway program. Uh, 70 of our freshman took it last year. 90 of our juniors and seniors take it this year. And it's almost like a a break from school. It's like recess. You're using compound miter saws. You can cut your hand off. It's it gives me a little bit of anxiety throughout the day. um they go through the training for OSHA for safety, but that the sitting in a classroom eight times a day for 45 minutes is not not fun for a bunch of iPad kids. Got to got to have breaks.

[45:46]  You got to have them standing up. And I think a trades class where kids are learning hands-on skills that are practical, common sense things. Like kids are starving sitting on a sandwich. They don't they don't know how to do basic things at all. And so creating a sense of responsibility. Um I think every parent, if a parent's listening to this, get your kid a pet. Every kid should know how to take care of a fish, know how to take care of a little frog, um know how to take care of a dog or cat. I think it's so important for kids to learn responsibility. Uh and they don't have to now. They can just live vicariously through the iPad and iPhone and create little emoji cats and dogs that run around in virtual spaces. It's like, "Hey, you got to you got to look out for for little Pepe. Pepe is going to starve. You must give your tortoise some celery.

[46:31]  Listen, Ike, for time's sake, man, I I know that you've um you're preparing students for college. Uh not just for college, actually. You're preparing them for life. And and I appreciate that. And you're doing it through that spiritual guidance. You're doing it through culture. You're doing it through helping others face their their challenges um in a certain you're doing it Chicago, a very diverse city. Um, so we just kind of thank you for all the work that you've done at such a young age too, man. You got so many more years ahead of you. I I want to just kind of lead into this blind question. So, no prep, just raw honesty here. If you could actually build your own high school curriculum from scratch, no restrictions, what's one class every student in America has to take before they graduate? Can I do two?

[47:15]  Sure. Uh, first one would be a a handyman, handywoman skills class. uh you know how to change a tire, you know how to um troubleshoot when your refrigerator's broken, you understand how a radio works, you can take a chain off and put it back on a bike. Those those sorts of things I think are so good for kids this digital age. Uh second thing is learn Spanish. Um I think the celebration of bilingualism is so important. You know the joke of what do you call someone who speaks two languages? bilingual, three languages, triilingual. Yeah. One language American. Like Americans don't know Americans don't know two languages. That is true. That is true. And so I speak Spanish. Uh I learned it in high school.

[48:03]  And so I think I think it's with uh immigration just coming from the southern border. uh with we're we're half Latino, half black as a school um with a sprinkling of white and Asian kids, but being able to speak Spanish, it it gives you access to leadership. Anyone who's kind of got like just an average kid intellectually with an average work ethic, if you're bilingual, you can manage dozens of other employees because the the flow of immigrants to this country is going to continue. And I think we should celebrate the hard work and the ambition that immigrants have to come to this country. Um, every political opinion about the border wall, leave that there. Aside from that, but the the immigrants who are here are willing to work the jobs that Americans

[48:50]  are not. And so since those are usually lower rung um manual labor responsibilities, if you're bilingual, you can manage dozens of employees. I don't care if it's at restaurants, in the service industry, in construction. And so being bilingual, I think, is so important. Um, and it helps you value other cultures for people who don't look like you. Uh, I think that's I think that's special.

[49:15]  Ike, man, you you're you're leading, you're inspiring, you're building something so incredible. Um, so it's just an honor to get to meet you, see what you're doing out there in the world for young kids. I think it's it's it's dope. You know what I'm saying? I want you to talk to those people that are still watching um and still listening to this. How can they be of support? How can they donate or just get involved into um your mission? Yeah. Uh so Chicago Academy um we're on the west side of Chicago. If you ever want to visit, it's the coolest place in the world. Little slice of heaven on earth.

[49:47]  Um you won't leave here without having a a big laugh or a heart tug. Um which would be would be special for any guest who comes in. Uh, I think spreading the word about us is amazing. If you're ever interested, you can go to our website. Uh, you can donate. Um, if you know anyone connected with resources or a foundation, uh, we we love, uh, having sort of referrals to us to help our kids have scholarships.

[50:14]  Without scholarships, our school shuts down. Um, so we have to raise about $5 million each year. And every little every dollar counts. Every dollar helps. Um, and beyond that, if people don't have financial resources or a big network, you can always pray for us. Think about our kids. Uh, lots of times people think the west side of Chicago, oh, it's too dangerous. It's it's all the stereotypes. Um, it's easier just not to deal with it, but we say, "Hey, the grass the grass isn't greener on the other side. The grass is greener where you water it." And so, we're we're staying we're we're believing in kids from the west side. And, uh, I love it.

[50:50]  I think it's I think it's awesome. Um, we've got we're working on a documentary right now. Uh, so we got we got more coming. We got more coming your way, but get to know us before before we blow up. Uh, hope we're I love this. Ike, man, this conversation has truly been masterass in leadership, in faith, impact. You're you're really doing the damn thing in Chicago Hope Academy, man. It's going to only continue to grow. I can't wait to see what's next. You talked about documentary. Hell yeah. I'm ready for it. I'm ready to see you back at Good Morning America all over my Tik Tok, man. Going viral. If you guys have been inspired today, get involved, support, and mostly um make sure you're following what Ike is doing, leading with your heart. Ike, thank you so much for your time. This has been the Heart and Hustle

[51:37]  Podcast. We'll catch you guys on the next one. Peace. Latest.