The Dean Who Lives On Campus and Shows Up for Everything

[0:16]  We're back here on the Heart and Hunter Podcast. We have Miss Holly Taylor. How you doing today, ma'am?

[0:20]  I'm doing well. How are you doing?

[0:22]  I'm doing good, can't complain. Where are you virtually visiting from today?

[0:25]  Okay. Today I'm visiting you from Brunau University in beautiful Gainesville, Georgia.

[0:30]  Gainesville, Georgia. See, I'm from Florida. So you say Gainesville, I'm automatically thinking Florida.

[0:37]  Yes, yeah. I think a lot of people do. I think there's a Gainesville, like Texas or something as well. So yeah.

[0:42]  I'm all confused now. Look at that. There's not just one Gainesville, that's multiple. and how

[0:47]  Right.

[0:48]  long have you been at the ch at the school?

[0:50]  So I got to Brunau in August of two thousand twenty two. I I was excited about the opportunity and this is a cool place. So I'm glad to be glad to be here.

[0:59]  And have you been working in the higher ed space for some time, I'm guessing?

[1:02]  Yes, for quite a while. I just had my twenty year anniversary working in higher education this past summer. So it's been a minute. and I've had those experience or those twenty years at four different universities. So it's been really cool to see the changes and all the different students from different parts of the the whole East Coast and all around the world really.

[1:22]  I love that. Yeah, yeah. When think about the higher ed, you really get people from all around the world, you know, from West Coast coming to East Coast. I mean, from other countries, I can imagine, coming to the East Coast

[1:33]  Yeah.

[1:33]  as well. Wanted to partake in that educational space. twenty years like, did it feel like it was just yesterday you got started?

[1:40]  Yeah, in some ways for sure. And in other ways it feels all of those twenty years, right? it's crazy. The world has changed so much, our students have changed so much, everything is different than it was in two thousand six, right? So it's a cool, it's been a cool adventure, but it definitely yeah, it definitely feels like it's been a blink of an eye in some ways.

[2:02]  And for twenty years, like what what what do you feel about and your work that you've done in higher ed? Like how does it make you feel? What what comes to mind? What are those words if you say the last twenty years felt this way?

[2:17]  you know what? I saw this little thing on Instagram the other day that it resonated with me a lot. And it said, What a privilege it is to be exhausted from doing something that you chose to do and you love. Basically, that's the the

[3:00]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[4:38]  gist of it. And I thought that's exactly how I feel. And that's specifically how I feel this week because we just got through with a week of new student orientation and student leader training, this week's welcome week, next week's NPC sorority recruitment. So like I'm t I'm exhausted. But what a privilege that is to be able to do this with these awesome students. It's a really cool, it's a really cool gig. I tell people all the time here, I have the best job on campus and I stand ten toes down about that.

[8:15]  I love it. I love it. And and are you I'm guessing you still boots on the ground often? Like what is your role today currently actually?

[9:47]  Yeah. Yeah. So currently I serve as the assistant vice president and the dean of students here at Brunel and I'm very boots on the ground. I think probably to the point where students are like, This girl is all I'm at all the stuff. I go to the dance concerts and the art gallery openings and the things that my students are doing because I think that a big part of my job is actually just showing up, like being there, making sure students know that we're not just faces or email addresses, that we are humans that care. I also as I also live on campus and so I am literally here all the time. It's great.

[11:10]  How how did you get into higher ed? Like is this something that you left high school and you said, Hey, this this is it? or how did we get here?

[13:35]  to be totally transparent, it was all an accident, and I'm very grateful for that. When I was a brand new student at UNC Greensboro in August 2000, we had a big, you know, residence hall meeting those first couple days of school, and they said, Hey, we're gonna elect one of you to be like our our residence hall representative. I didn't know all this at the time, but for the residence hall association that would then advocate for things with Student Government Association, which then could get to the leadership of campus, right? And I said, that sounds cool. I'm gonna do that. And so I rewrote the lyrics to the Sam Cook song, What a Wonderful World. You know, don't know much about history. And I sang

[15:14]  Yeah.

[15:14]  it for my residence hall and they elected me as the president that year. And that was actually the first, like my first little step into like the leadership of the university, like how universities operate. And I just thought it was the coolest thing. So anyway, that was twenty six years ago.

[15:55]  W was that was that like were you already doing that in high school or was this also new to you?

[19:07]  Not really. I was a really shy kid in middle school and high school. I think I did student government. I played a couple of sports. I played piano and stuff, but I was just really shy. And college felt like a a good time to kind of like break out of that bubble. And so it's a cool thing to encourage my students to do now too.

[23:58]  Wow, yeah, no that that's pretty cool. you know, just the passion that you've had that really led you into this career that you're in today that you mentioned is doesn't even feel like work. Like I'm truly having fun doing what I'm doing. Right.

[24:54]  Yeah. Yeah, I feel lucky for that.

[27:21]  And and how many students did you guys have? You talked about just kind of enrollment coming in, all these new students. What does that look like?

[27:49]  Yeah. We have an awesome Birdie Full campus when we talk about our residential population. We're just over four hundred students who live on our campus here. overall

[28:21]  Mm-hmm.

[28:22]  though, Brunau University has multiple campuses and a pretty strong online community. So we have about twenty five hundred, three thousand students at any given

[28:52]  Wow.

[28:53]  time. Mm-hmm.

[28:56]  Yeah, yeah. No, that's that's a lot. what

[29:36]  Yeah.

[29:41]  what what what stories do you have of those like a lot of times we do the work and we forget the why, but then these stories come back and it's like, man, this is why I do it. Do you have that story that just kind of comes back and allows you to you know, remember the why?

[30:45]  I could name a lot of stories over the years. just students that you see change in such significant ways. You see students come into a university, I think like I was a lot, like shy and timid, not knowing. And you're also meeting all these different people from vastly different backgrounds, socioeconomic backgrounds, family makeup, all these different things, states, cultures, whatever it is. And it is a wild time. So to see somebody. look internally, transform themselves, build themselves up, go to classes, join organizations and do all these things and then leave, you know, with their chests a little higher. It it's a beautiful thing to see. I see that at Brun we have these statues outside of our art gallery. And one statue is a girl going in and she's kind of you know head down and timid and looking scared. And then the one on the other side she's standing up hands on her hips head held high. And I think that's such an awesome representation of what higher education should look like.

[30:47]  Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I do agree. I think that and I say this often with other leaders, like I didn't realize what college really does. And I didn't step foot. I I guess I had some college. I didn't graduate per se. I got like two classes left for an associate. So one I'm gonna get I'm gonna get through Holly. But

[30:48]  Yeah, yeah.

[30:48]  when I hear these conversations, I realize that this college is really it helps people get to the next level, right? Like when you're in high school, that transition of going into the real world is hard and College allows you to fail, allows you the community, allows you the people to learn from, right? Those cheerleaders don't leave your side. You just have new cheerleaders leaving high school. and

[30:49]  Right.

[30:49]  those that don't go to college, they might fall through the cracks a little bit, you know, and and struggle a little bit, things like that. But I think people got college universities all wrong, right? I think for a lot of people it it becomes, it's just a lot of money, it's debt. But And every time I speak to somebody in higher ed, it's like you gotta look at it from a different perspective. So what is your mindset on that for those that are

[30:50]  Yeah.

[30:50]  looking at it? It's just debt.

[30:50]  I think you make a great point. And I have a couple thoughts about that. One, I do think that higher education is worth it for a lot of folks. I also don't think it's worth it for everybody. And I think that we need to do a better job of educating our young folks on options. Option, all of the options. Higher education, there's also an array of options there, right? If you want to pay a lot of money and you have the ability to get yourself into a Harvard or a Princeton. or s an Ivy League of some sort, then that's incredible. And I hope that that does set you up for success in the way that you want to be set up. but for some folks that's just not necessary. And if we're talking about debt, you know, our students are so consumer minded these days, so much more than twenty years ago. And I think that's a good thing. We have to be responsible with the loans that we're taking out or giving out or whatever. And so yeah, I think I think that higher education is a really great stepping stool for a lot of folks. And it was for me. I loved my journey. It's been amazing. and we need to be honest about what people's goals are and how they can get there the most efficiently, effectively, cost effectively, right? All the things.

[30:52]  And you mentioned just the change over the years, right, that you've seen. How do we meet students at where they're at? I think life is so different. We always talk about curation, right? Curating for that individual. Because almost everything in life nowadays is so curated for us, right? Whether it's our timelines, whether it's our Netflix, things like that. How are we as or you guys as leaders in the higher ed space really curating to the next generation? How are we meeting them at where they're at?

[31:08]  Yeah, I think one of the things we have to keep doing is asking the questions because our students are changing so much with every year that passes. We talk a lot about like maybe it was some of the COVID years and where our students were at developmentally and how that changed society and all of us individually. I think, you know, one of the things where I meet the students is online. I meet them on social media and TikTok and Instagram. they can DM me there to ask questions about anything. I don't care. That's the same thing as email to folks. Great, I'm happy to meet you there. but the communication piece of making sure that we're asking students to help us communicate what they need in that moment or through their journey is imperative. and I also think that one of the changes in higher ed is that our students are more vocal, they're more confident about saying what they need. And I love that. one of my very first days at Brunel University, I had an international student. I hope Esther sees this at some point. I'm gonna call her out by name because she would appreciate that.

[31:43]  Ha ha ha.

[31:43]  She walked into my office. She's like, You're not this university is not doing enough for commuter students or international students. I said, tell tell me. Like, it's my third day on the job. Like, let me let me get so let me start writing something down. but

[31:51]  Tell me more, yeah, yeah.

[31:52]  I love that energy. Great, because we can't guess. And I think it's it's hard in higher education because we want to, we think we know the things, right? Like We know how to throw a good party. We know how to get a slip and slide and a DJ and stuff like that. But if you don't want a slip and slide and a DJ, that's not gonna connect. That's not meeting students where they're at. So, yeah, communication imperative

[31:55]  Love that.

[31:55]  in this. Yeah.

[31:55]  D do you think the communication is also important now with the parents more than ever?

[31:55]  I do, I do. Parents are such a crucial part of the success of their students or family supporters, whoever we're talking about, that the student has in their lives. A lot of our parents also are are signing off on loans or helping pay those bills. And so they have a financial investment, you know, in this as

[31:57]  Mm-hmm.

[31:57]  well as being invested in their student. I love communicating with parents and I think that many of many of them that are invested in the process with their student have a good experience and they kind of understand how universities operate, right?

[31:58]  Yeah. When when we talk about communication, I think there's this sense of one, we talked about meeting people where they're at, but it becomes a lot, right? You just kind of mentioned this space of onboarding these new students. Do you feel that AI plays a part on some of these students not falling through cracks? Because we're able to enter frequently asked questions ahead of time, really preparing parents and students for the day of. Are we doing any of that at the higher ed space?

[32:01]  I'm sure a lot of folks are. I've been thinking about that a lot recently. And I think that that's a s a place where it's it would be a learning edge for me and for Brunel to utilize that more. We're having a ton of conversations about how we need to teach students how to utilize AI in a responsible way and within the boundaries of academic integrity. but I think it feels different on the staff side to think about using AI. but yeah, it's definitely something I'm thinking about.

[32:04]  Are you using any version of AI, attach a PT, Claude, any of those basic Gemini's?

[32:04]  Yeah, we are using Gemini. we have, you know, Google. and so it's interesting. I do use it once in a while. I joked with students that there's this point of the year where all of them need a letter of recommendation. And I think that they're all funny and talented and beautiful and smart. And how do I say that in three different ways to the same sorority, the same internship, the same whatever they're all applying for? it's very helpful when you use it as a tool to just kind of get your mind straight. You know, about what you need to be doing.

[32:07]  I love it, as you mentioned, AI is truly a tool, right? It is how

[32:08]  Yeah.

[32:08]  does it help us do a better job at what we're doing without losing the people touch? because I don't think that AI replaces people, but it definitely allows people to do better and maybe a little bit more efficient. And I'm I'm just I see it at the high school level just because I'm kind of involved at that level and realize that we're not teaching it at high school yet. But It's because of the fear, right? The educators may not know. They're just kind of fear of what does it look like? And the guardrails and all these different things. And my partner Keenan actually says, Eframe, we're at the worst time of AI because it's only going to get better. Right. And it is so true. While we think, my God, it's so great. It's like, we're barely getting there. You know, what does it look like in the next five years? what it does with data, I don't know if you've ever like put anything in there and it would like call out something wrong that you'd even notice. You're like, my God, like how did I not see that? Right. But that's just kind of the beauty in it is that you do have that the reference check per se. Not so much that it needs to do the work for you, but you can put it in and says, hey, let me know how this is looking. Is there anything that I could do better? are you guys integrating

[32:15]  Sure.

[32:15]  AI classes at the higher ed space?

[32:15]  you know what, I'm not sure about Brunel. I know we have faculty who are are teaching our students how to use it

[32:16]  Mm.

[32:16]  realistically, but I'm not sure how far in depth they're going in the classrooms here.

[32:16]  Okay. All right. Nah, this is exciting. This is exciting to to know that at least you guys are in the direction of like AI's here. We we understand that we gotta utilize. We're gonna figure it out at first. and then

[32:18]  Yeah.

[32:18]  we'll you know, we'll roll it that out. What are some of the things that maybe people need to know about your university that they don't know that people don't find out until years later?

[32:18]  wow. well, one, Brnowell's a great place. It's a it's the coolest place I've worked just because it's so different and it's so special. but it is a historic women's college. So a lot of folks

[32:18]  Okay.

[32:18]  think that Brunau University is still just for women. and it's not. We have a a great women's college program that has been in existence since the late 1800s and will continue on. And we also have the undergraduate college. for our folks who do not identify as female. and then we have our like I said earlier, our online programs and other things like that. So

[32:18]  Are you are you seeing an uptick? All good. I

[32:18]  To be honest, my brain just kind of glitched.

[32:18]  actually wanted to know on the space of online. Are you seeing an uptick on that? Like more people wanting to do online?

[32:18]  It depends. Some of our programs, yes, some no. It just it fluctuates.

[32:18]  Okay, because I would just think just more people, especially in the working field, may appreciate an online class, one or two classes. I mean, at least I did. When I was working a six AM to four or five PM, best believe I had an online class because I just felt it was it was

[32:18]  Yeah.

[32:18]  just a little easier for me to kind of get by. You know what I mean? I just sometimes didn't like there are some classes you needed to have a teacher. There are some classes I I quickly learned like, my god, I need to be in class for this one because this online me teaching myself ain't working.

[32:18]  Yeah.

[32:18]  do you feel like that's what happens sometimes when people get into the online and realize maybe this should not be an online class? I need to get in person. Do you see those often?

[32:18]  yeah, once in a while. And we actually have a policy that our residential students can't take fully online. Like they gotta take a couple in-person classes. Cause if you're living on campus, we got to see you once in a while, you know.

[32:18]  Yeah, right.

[32:18]  but yeah, I think our online program is really helpful. We also have a pretty strong veteran presence in our student demographics, and that's exciting. We're pretty proud of that. And so we serve students literally all over the world and work with them to make sure that they're education isn't deferred when they might be deployed or other things like that. I think I mentioned earlier we also have several campuses and one of those campuses is in North Atlanta. So that helps us reach students in that greater Atlanta metro area as well as online.

[32:18]  I love it. And do do you feel that you talked about those multiple campuses? Is it because we just wanted to meet people at in different communities or just the schools started to see kind of an uptick on students coming in? So we had to just kind of diversify. What what was the reasoning behind spreading out so so much?

[32:18]  Yeah, I think a little bit of both. we've also had campuses in other parts of Savannah or other parts of Georgia just to try to serve the greater the state of Georgia. especially

[32:18]  Mm-hmm.

[32:18]  in the Atlanta metro area. There's so many folks around here, and we're only about an hour north of Atlanta, less from our North Atlanta campus. So yeah, it it's a good way to spread out and and get more folks involved in Burnout.

[32:18]  Yeah, for sure. And what is your end goal? I mean, you you talked about doing this now for twenty years. Is your thought one day I wanna go ahead and actually run a college or university? Or are you just kind of okay where you're at these days?

[32:18]  I I think that people who are presidents and vice presidents of universities are incredible and I think they're amazing and I would love to work for them for a long time. I don't have an interest in

[32:18]  Ha ha ha.

[32:18]  being the president. I being like Dean Taylor on this campus is like the best thing ever. It's so fun to get to meet students out in the things that they're doing at their concerts and shows and whatever they're up to. It's fun, you know, when they s when they're walking to class and just saying hi and catching up informally. This is my favorite gig of my career and I don't really want to go into

[32:18]  What was your degree in, Holly?

[32:18]  I got my undergraduate degree in communication studies and marketing, just because I had to pick something. I had no idea what I wanted to do. So

[32:18]  I mean you're kind of in it though when you think about it, huh? It li lined up with the work that you're doing today.

[32:18]  Yeah, for sure. That program at UNC Greensboro was writing intensive and it was speaking intensive. And I said, Well, if I can write and I can speak, I will figure out the rest later and that's kind of what happened.

[32:18]  I mean, those are two tools that you really need in life is how to communicate and how to write, right? Like I always say

[32:18]  Yeah, absolutely.

[32:18]  you have to be able to communicate with someone. you mentioned Esther, what's her name?

[32:18]  Yes.

[32:18]  Right? Communicating, right? Like that's a huge piece. If if she would never

[32:18]  Yes.

[32:18]  mention that, how would we know? And a lot of times people do not know if no one's ever mentioned it or if they're not utilizing their voices in in in in in a sense. so I love that you guys are kind of open door, like, hey. feel free to have these conversations. We're definitely looking to always make those changes, realizing that we have to grow, right? And and it looks like you guys have done a lot. If you sit here and think about the next few years, what are some of the goals that you actually have in mind that you would love to accomplish within personal or even the school?

[32:18]  Yeah. with the school, I w I think we're working a lot on engagement and retention. and I s those could be listed in either order, but we need to figure out better and more ways to get our students involved on campus. There's a lot of research in the higher ed space saying that students that are more involved tend to stay longer, they still tend to be happier, they have a, you know, group of folks to lean on in general. So just getting folks involved in whatever they want to do. One of the great things about higher ed, I think at every university I've worked at is you can make your own organization. You don't even have to fit into whatever we want you to do. You can do whatever and we'll support you as long as it's reasonable and legal and all of that. I think personally I really am focusing on the orientation part of my job. I'm really excited to have some professional development coming up. I think that onboarding process is crucial and it's not something I ever did before I got to Brunell. So it's definitely a learning edge for me. And I'm excited to see what that looks like. We had a greater turnout this past orientation than we had in previous years. So I feel great about that. We had some really great survey feedback about partly about what they learned and partly about the satisfaction with the events. And so I'm excited to dig through that a little bit and see how I can continue to grow that program. and make sure all of our students feel really good on their first day of school. I want them to end orientation thinking, all right, I think I can do this or at least know where to go for help.

[32:18]  Yeah, 'cause it's all in the experience, you say, right? Like if a student's having a

[32:18]  Yeah.

[32:18]  good experience from day one, it allows them to just feel like they're part of this community that they've signed up for, per se, right? And then we want them to continue to feel part of the community. So you mentioned kind of like that retention, the conversation, the allowing them to know what's going on in the school. I think it's it's so pivotal. Do you guys also do the same for even alumni, kind of reaching back out to them and like and inviting them to certain things?

[32:18]  Yeah, absolutely. We have a whole staff in our alumni development office and they actually start with our undergraduate students saying, Hi, we're the alumni office and we already love you and we want you to persist through the university and then keep hanging out with us. So yeah, we have a whole crew of people who are doing that work.

[32:18]  When you do anything different, twenty years of doing this, you go back to anything that you feel like, man, I wish I could've done this different.

[32:19]  I'm sure there are 1,000 things I could say. And I'm sure that many

[32:19]  Ha ha

[32:19]  of them involve me saying something I may not should have said. Cause sometimes my mouth might get me in trouble a little bit. I you know, I think I'm maybe I would be a little kinder to myself and the students that I was working with because I spent so much time working in student conduct offices. That's a really challenging place to be to only work with students who are in trouble, only, you know, investigate really sometimes terrible things. And so there was a lot of it that was that was just really challenging and I think I would give myself and the students a little bit more grace if I could go back.

[32:19]  I just thought to myself that I didn't even realize like you don't think about college and people getting in trouble. You know what I mean? Like I don't know that I've ever thought about that, but you just said that. I'm like, wow, there's an office for those that get in trouble. But I guess, right? We that's just me me

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  thinking that the good in people, but it's like I I guess, yeah, there could be even that happening

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  in college because we're still talking about young adults and even adults that act like kids. So actually makes complete sense. Good thing I never seen that office, Holly. That means I was doing good.

[32:19]  Exactly. I love

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  it when students used to say you to me, like, I've never met you and I'm like, Great, I love that for both of us, you know. Yeah.

[32:19]  Yeah, yeah, that's that's so cool. and and just as we start to wrap up, like what are some of the best parts of living on campus? 'Cause you didn't mention that earlier and I think that's kind of fascinating.

[32:19]  Yeah, I it's it's interesting to be in my forties and living on campus for the first time in twenty-something years. but honestly, it's great. It it's it provides me the privilege of being able to wake up not as you know, early in the mornings. But

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  it more than that, it's about, you know, seeing having students see me, like going on walks after work, lugging in groceries, taking out my trash. Like I appreciate that there's some normalcy to that because I don't want students to ever feel like I can't talk to this person because they wear this name badge or they have this title or whatever. I think a lot of folks on this campus feel that way, but I I have the privilege of living here. So I get to kinda hang out with students not socially but informally.

[32:19]  Yeah. I love it. I do love that you could always be authentically you and and people see that. I think, especially nowadays more than ever, our young ones are looking for that authentic leader that they could gravitate to and have open conversations with. And I just think it is cool that you say, Hey, I'm taking all the trash, I'm just being me, because a lot of the times I think people feel like this happened to me recently, like, hey man, you you you should definitely put on like a suit and tie, you know. And I'm thinking like, why? You know what I mean? Like what that doesn't make me any better or less than, right? Like I want to show up as me. And I was at the high school level and I'm like, I'm probably actually more approachable than you because I am in regular clothes. You know, like yes, there's a time for the suit and tie. I get it. But it's like you want to just be you. You want you don't need to sit here and put on a mask or put on this outfit and it's going to make you f the leader. It's like we live that, right? Every single day by the things that we do and the way that we show up. Is a people love that. People do business with people. So I can imagine, Holly, you're you're you're one of the faves at the school because of it. Because they see you being normal. They see you just being yourself and you know, the bubbly Holly. It looks like are you still mixing up songs as well or?

[32:19]  No. I think every once in a while I'll post something on my Instagram, but I wish I had more time to play music. I've been going to bluegrass jams on the weekends in Atlanta to try to just play some music and, you know, do something for myself every once in a while. So that's fun.

[32:19]  Let's let's finish up there. How do you do for yourself? Like how do you turn it off? Because Holly Taylor is still an individual, right? And while this is a part of her of who she is, I can imagine there's things that you love. What is that thing that you kind of get lost in when it's not school?

[32:19]  music is a big one. Listening, singing, playing, whatever that is. music can take me to a good place pretty much any time I need it to. that's something I need to be better about. My friends call me out on that, my family's called me out on that, that I'm happy to send a text or an email real quick whenever I need to, or kind of be available

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  for folks. And I just I really do love my students so much. I want to be there for them. So I do step away once in a while. I do play some music. I go hiking a lot. I've gotten into that a lot since I moved to Georgia. I'm enjoying the state park system down here. So I do escape once

[32:19]  Okay.

[32:19]  in a while.

[32:19]  And for the music, what did you your choice of music?

[32:19]  all kinds of stuff. If I'm working in my office and I just have Spotify playing, it's usually like nineties, early two thousands hip hop or rap. If I'm playing music, it's like

[32:19]  Yeah, Holly.

[32:19]  if I'm playing music it's like Bob Dylan or bluegrass or folk music or something. So the spectrum.

[32:19]  I love music as well. I'd be in my own home sometimes doing dishes, cleaning on a weekend, have yeah, I got two

[32:19]  Yes.

[32:19]  little ones. I got my headphones on. I'm just and like you, I'm listening to the old school 90s, 2000. There was music is

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  not the same, Holly, okay? It is not the same.

[32:19]  Thank you. I do have a lot of respect for some of the new film, Kendrick and J. Cole and some of the right, but it's not it's not the same. But that's okay. It

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  doesn't need to be the same.

[32:19]  Same. I I I agree. The the the Kendricks, the J. Cole's, I love that you mentioned those. Those are two great artists that still I don't feel like has reached their fullest potential. and may not just to this new generation, but they definitely fall within that category of some of you know my faves. My favorite rapper though of all time, just to kind of let you know, is Eminem. I don't know what it is, but I I love I love Eminem. Like there's just nobody better than him.

[32:19]  I agree. I remember vividly the first time I heard my name is on the radio in nineteen ninety, whenever that came. I'm serious. I vividly remember thinking, What is the who is this? What and now I yeah, I'm obsessed. I love him too.

[32:19]  Yeah, I'm just sad that I couldn't see him in concert. Like whenever he comes and does concerts in US, I gotta go. I think now he's doing a lot of stuff overseas, just because that's where I guess they get a lot more respect, especially our our old timers. They go overseas. So I'm like, I got I might have to go overseas and just see this guy because I

[32:19]  Hey.

[32:19]  I haven't I don't go to a lot of concerts, but Chris Brown is one of the concerts I went to. And I think that was a really fun concert. I've

[32:19]  Nice. Cool.

[32:19]  been to like a pit bull Jennifer Lopez concert. Earlier on, those are always

[32:19]  My

[32:19]  cool. But it's I need to see an MM. I want to know what that feels like. And I need I need to feel that crowd

[32:19]  Yeah, yeah.

[32:19]  because it's it's always cool to be in that crowd of just like-minded people. Like when we talk about community, that's

[32:19]  Yes.

[32:19]  what's so cool about the college level. Like all the people are like-minded. We're here for to better ourselves. We come from all

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  different walks of life, but we're here for the greater good, is to better and educate ourselves. So that's what it feels like to be kind of in that music space. So I love it. I love that you do.

[32:19]  Yes.

[32:19]  at least fall into music, especially sometimes you gotta lose yourself in something. And good music is a good way to lose yourself. Or if you wanna lose yourself on the trail, that's cool too.

[32:19]  Yeah, if it's not too hot. Night this time of year we're not trail hiking. It's too much.

[32:19]  I went to Arizona this summer. Yeah, don't ask me how I got there. But it was so hot. First of all, don't go. Hotly. If you've never been, don't go, especially during the summertime. I heard it's better during kind of like you know, January, February time, winter time. But it was so hot that people forget to hydrate. And on our way to the Red Mountains, we've seen someone being carried out in a body bag. So it is one of those things

[32:19]  my gosh.

[32:19]  that, yeah, you gotta Keep safe, Holly. Okay. Definitely keep safe.

[32:19]  Yeah.

[32:19]  Keep hydrated. Keep having fun. But take care of yourself more importantly. All right. There you go. Yeah, yeah. Look. People laugh at it.

[32:19]  Yes, yes, yeah.

[32:19]  This is my wife's when she gave birth. This is the cup they gave her at the hospital. It just

[32:19]  Yes. Awesome. Yes.

[32:19]  allows me to drink a lot of water, okay? That's why I I utilize this cup. But Holly,

[32:19]  Right. I love it.

[32:19]  it's definitely been a pleasure to just have this conversation authentically with you and seeing what you're doing at the higher ed level. if you could just leave those that are watching, your your your colleagues that may be kind of in the space of the unknown with what's happening at a government level, how do you keep them at peace?

[32:19]  Mm.

[32:19]  What is your words of wisdom to these individuals?

[32:19]  That's such a good question. You know, the thing I tell families and students is that we're always gonna try our best because we don't know what's coming. We don't know what the next election would bring or next policy change or whatever. The people that are working at the universities are there because they care and they're there because they want to help students. So whatever the next guidance is or the next heaven forbid pandemic or whatever. There are humans at these universities that care deeply about our students and we will do whatever is best for the community to make sure that everybody gets the best shot at success.

[32:20]  I love it. Well, Holly, thank you so much for your time. For those that are still watching, make sure that you guys do like, subscribe, and comment because that's how we know that you enjoy these great conversations with leaders that are in spaces of pouring into others. It is not a selfish work, it is selfless work. it's not about a paycheck, it is truly about passion and purpose. Holly today showed us exactly what that actually looked like. Living on campus, it gets it gets no more like more passion, more purpose build than that. I'm Efrain. This is Harley. We appreciate you and we'll catch you on the next one. Latest.

[32:20]  Thank you.