"These Could Be Your Children" - Leslie McGuire's Fight Against Youth Homelessness

[0:16]  Welcome back to another episode here on the Heart and Hustle podcast. Our next guest, she turned eight and a half years of quiet grid into a movement transforming how an entire organization so shows up for the homeless youth. So Leslie, I appreciate you. What made you stay in a room when most people would have just walked away?

[0:38]  Hey, great to be here and thanks for having me. Um, I would say that it's truly the mission of Covenant House that has kept me in this work. I love this organization. I so believe in what we do and believe in the young people that we exist to serve. So, it's really been nothing but an honor and a pleasure to be able to be on this journey and play my part in contributing to our mission.

[1:04]  And the first time I spoke to you, Leslie, you mentioned how Covenant House felt like coming home. Was there a moment when you knew, yeah, this is it?

[1:14]  Uh, definitely. I I knew that pretty early on in my tenure at Covenant House. Um, you know, I think as someone who has spent their career in the nonprofit world, I am very much driven by mission. Um, and every organization I've worked in has always had a compelling mission for me. Um, but you know, sometimes you get in and maybe the culture is not as strong or operationally, you know, not as strong. And at Covenant House, we really just have the trifecta of all of that. And we truly lead by our mission and principles and are very much driven by making decisions for what's best for our young people. Um, and it's it's just a a pretty spectacular organization um, in terms of our aspirations and the work that we can do and and obviously the mission that we're working towards.

[2:11]  How long have you been with the Covenant House?

[2:13]  I have been at Covenant House International now for eight and a half years.

[2:18]  Almost a whole decade. I couldn't imagine. It probably felt like just yesterday you got there and here you are so much longer. Um, how big is this organization for those that are reading can realize how big the organization actually is that we're talking about?

[2:30]  Sure. So, Covenant House is quite a large organization. We're a fed federated organization and we have 18 Covenant House affiliates that operate in the US, Canada, Guatemala, Honduras, and Mexico. We reach about 57,000 young people across the Americas each year. So, quite quite a big organization. And I work at our headquarters. This is cool. Where's the headquarters located?

[2:55]  We're in New York City.

[2:57]  New York City. Wow. That's a lot. That's a lot. That's a lot. So, tell us some of the things that you guys do when we talk about homelessness and some of the programs and services that you guys offer at the Coven House.

[3:06]  Sure. Um, the the primary focus of our programs and services really is residential. Um, so it's about getting young people off the streets and being able to provide them a continuum of residential care where they can really um stabilize and launch off to their next future. So, we've got short-term residential programs that are more shelter-like. We've got some transitional housing, independent housing, but the thing that makes Covenant House unique is that we really are a one-stop shop and have a full range of other supportive services to really help address any of the drivers of that young person's experience with homelessness. So, health and mental health services, education, if you don't have your high school diploma or GED or you want to go to college, we'll help you with that. um employment services. Everything from, you know, getting that first job, uh making your resume, mock interviews to even preparing young people for, you know, careers and pathways that will pay them a living wage as well as legal services, spiritual services, you name it, it's all available on site and quite comprehensive.

[4:17]  I love this. And when you took over the organization, if I'm not mistaken, it's a 53y old organization. Is that correct? Did I get my my stats? is a 53y old organization. Um I'm the chief program officer, so not the CEO. Um

[4:29]  not yet. Not yet.

[4:31]  No. No. But you you stepped into his organization still with so many deep roots and said we need a new map, right? We need a new way to look at it. How do you navigate the push back when you come in with this outside perspective? Did you feel like as you were implementing these ideas that you were getting pushed back to to uh to scale?

[4:50]  Yeah. So, I would say that the the directions that we're moving in now um really h didn't take hold until a few years ago. So, and and I would say also we're very much driven by the needs of our sites. So when Covenant House began 53 years ago, um you know, as a federated model, it was much more decentralized and our our affiliates are each their own nonprofits, 501c3s, and have a lot of autonomy. Um and with that, there was a lot of innovation that happened. Um program services able to sort of meet and adapt to local needs and resources and partnerships. But at the same time, you then have each of our 18 affiliates creating their own wheel for everything. And you have some programs and services then that aren't quite as standardized. And what I would say is that um we definitely over time had site leaders who needed more support from us and wanted that. And I think that really came to a head during COVID

[5:58]  when we were very much on the front lines of the pandemic. We never closed our doors and you know took young people in during that time and it was it was certainly a challenging time I think for our site leaders and site staff just to keep up with the work during that time. So I think it it really opened the door for our headquarters developing our first program team and being able to provide more support and resources so that each site didn't have to do trainings and you know program development and you know supported resources on their own. I'm telling you, nonprofits really had it hard during the pandemic. And to see so many that uh overcame and how they overcame and having to implement and having to it's like you've never seen a nonprofit actually move faster than it has during that time and and how much they've innovated during that time. When we talk about what we're doing at the organization level, are you guys are looking at to the next wave which is uh technology in the AI space. Have you guys actually adapted something like that? We I would say are in are in an exploratory phase with AI at the moment. Um I think there's a lot of opportunity for us in terms of our program data. So all of our Covenant House affiliates use the same program data platform. Think of it almost like an electronic health record. And we use this system called efforts to outcomes. So all the sites are on the same platform collecting the same information at intake at exit and at different junctures along the way so that we can really assess our impact and effectiveness. Um but when you think about the work you know the staff who come to Covenant House and work on the front line what what gets them up in the morning and drives them there is not you know entering information on on the computer. It's really about doing that engaging transformational work with our young people and it's frankly hard to find time to get the data entry pieces in. So, we are doing some exploratory work with some AI solutions that might be able to help with um you know better uh better uploading of case notes as well as then really um being able to look through all of the data we collect for keywords and things like that to really lift up key information about young people, risk factors for young people, things like that to really improve their um safety. the experience planning all the case planning all of that with us. So exploring but not yet um implementing but very much want to be on the front lines of that and use it to make our work more efficient and effective.

[8:40]  100%. I'm loving that you know that that's what it's there for. Right. It's a tool. It's not coming to take our job but it does just allow us to do things a little easier. Allow us to do the things that we love more. um and let AI technology do the things that we don't like like that admin work right the uh putting the data together if they could do that for us that's always great

[9:01]  data in general are really I would say just mission critical to our work because

[9:07]  um when we're able to really use the data effectively it tells us what's working not working what should we do more of what should we stop doing um and really how do we you know we we very much try and use our data to learn from it in those ways to tell us um you know where do we perhaps need to do more training for staff um and and different programs and interventions. So I feel like we've always been good users of the data and now excited about this next chapter with AI. I I spoke to a leader yesterday and he was just mentioning um he's like anytime he goes somewhere he loves to get data, right? He's like because I realize that when you speak to our our donors and you give them data, you know, you let them know where that money is going and that every dollar actually accumulates to almost $50, you know, and saying all these things, I'm like, "Yeah, that is so true." Because that's what people want to hear, right? That that's the ROI. So, hey, when you give, this is what's happening. you you you asked for your dollars to go here and look what we were able to do. So it's like yeah data is very crucial um and and making sure the data is organized. I I walked into an organization that there was data all over the place and I was like okay so we need to start hitting up donors but there's a list here there's a list here there's emails here but there's no email. So yeah, data could be very very crucial and has to be managed very well and then if you do have it as you mentioned putting that into an AI that now has the the brain of the organization uh per se to be able to actually have those conversations is pretty cool. I'm excited. I'm excited that you guys are actually kind of almost dipping your your toes into it per se. Yeah.

[10:43]  Right. I want to go back. You you keep saying affiliates, right? And is that like almost like a like franchises almost in a sense if you were thinking to the for-profit world or

[10:53]  um trying to think of what there are other federated systems probably in the for-profit world too but I guess it's a similar cont concept. So we've got like Covenant House Alaska, Covenant House California, etc., etc.

[11:09]  They use the name and then uh and now you guys are actually creating what the road map may look like. not completely but in a sense to kind of help them train um more efficiently. Is that correct?

[11:20]  Yeah, absolutely. We work very closely in partnership with our our sites and our affiliates. They're the ones, you know, doing the frontline work with young people. So, that's the way that we can add value to them is really by providing different trainings, resources, etc. to help them do their work better, help our young people achieve the best outcomes they can. If the Heart and Hustle podcast has ever sparked any idea or made you think differently, do us a favor. Make sure to guys share this, post it on LinkedIn, or even text that nonprofit friend that you just have. Whatever works. This is what keeps the conversation going and allows us to just grow this community together. Seriously, we appreciate you.

[12:04]  I think it's cool. How does someone get involved? Let's say someone wants to become an affiliate. What is the steps to get there? Um we

[12:14]  or if you don't know because that's not your your role then that's okay too.

[12:18]  Um I would say at this point we are definitely in a phase where we we will be doing some expanding of our housing continuum and maybe opening up covenant houses in new locations and really expanding. I mentioned before how you know we've got shelter to transitional housing. We're now going to be expanding into affordable for youth housing and I think that will be the place where we will be um probably opening in some new locations and really doing that in partnership with other organizations. So there's not an exact uh process around that, but people should feel free to reach out to me if they're interested in in learning more about that or or becoming part of Covenant House and and frankly the work that we're doing um with our program team as well. Right now, we're really focused on rolling out this adapted uh updated refresh model of care to all of our sites, but in a few years, we'd love to be able to pivot and really support other organizations that are out there serving young people experiencing homelessness who might not be part of a larger organization like Covenant House International. So, we'd be able to train other organizations in our approaches and and make our systems and resources available to them, too. It's not like you're having too much fun at work, Leslie, with all these things going on and and creating new things. It's not like you're having too much fun and lots of fun.

[13:43]  It is. That's something that's a nonprofit world in general, right? It's just you never know what you're going to walk into today. As much as much as we love what we do, every day is a new day. I think that's why we love what we do. Um you sit across from young people who has faced everything right so early on in lives. What what gives you hope in these moments um when the world itself doesn't even look, you know, put together?

[14:06]  Oh, I I feel so much hope for the work that we do and the young people that we serve. It's funny because a lot of people, you know, outside of my work circle will be like, "Oh, that that sounds very heavy. That must be so hard um or so sad." And quite to the contrary, it's so hopeful the week that we the work that we do. Um, the young people that we serve are so inspiring and they have hopes and dreams and talents just like any other young person that you know. Um, they've just been served with some bad luck in life, right? Um, but but there's the the group that we're serving. This is the opportunity where we can make such a difference. When you think about uh you know the young people we serve are in in the US and Canada generally between the ages of 18 and 24 in Latin America it's more 12 to 18 but developmentally this is such a critical juncture in life right um their path is going to go this way yeah

[15:08]  or their path is going to go that way and you know we have an opportunity to help end each young person's experience with homelessness and not see them funnel into chronic adult homelessness. And if we're able to get them the supports, the services that they need, help them on get onto a career pathway where they can, you know, live independently and sustainably. So, there's so much opportunity and hope there. So,

[15:36]  yeah,

[15:37]  you know, I

[15:38]  and everything that you mentioned really leads to helping them with their mental health, seeing things feeling feeling a lot better about themselves, seeing things a lot better than they what they seen it. Um, and that's what really re reshapes individuals as you mentioned to go one way versus the other having leaders, mentors. Uh, it's always when I think about nonprofits truly, we're just like mentors, you know, because what we do and how we pour in the conversation that we have, we're seeing another uh young individual and we're like, some of us may have been in those shoes, so we're speaking from experience. Um, some of us may have heard these stories and seen some overcome them. So, we're still speaking from experience. Some, you know, like yourself, Leslie, kind of been in this space for so long. How are you guys feel that you're reshaping that truth into into a strategy at Covenant House?

[16:22]  Yeah, I think I'll I'll talk specifically about the mental health piece because I think that's a really critical component. We recently launched a new strategic roadmap to end youth homelessness. It's a big lofty goal, but we absolutely believe that we can accomplish that. And one of the areas of focus for us is going to be really um doubling down in mental health for our young people because when you think about um a young person experiencing homelessness, if they've got a significant mental health challenge, the odds of them really funneling into chronic adult homelessness are are pretty strong, right? Um but if we're able to get them help and hope, um there's a lot that can change in that trajectory. So more than half of the young people who we serve at Covenant House do have a mental health challenge. Um and it's not a surprise because that age range really is the age of onset for mental health conditions. Um 75% of all mental health conditions onset by age 24. So often people are having their first experience and it could be part of their driver of um their experience with homelessness. And we do a pretty terrible job in this country though of getting people help in a timely way. Most people go 10 years between the onset of their symptoms and actually getting treatment. And treatment can make all the difference. But in my experience as a social worker, so many young people have no idea that what they're experiencing is something called depression, for example, something that there is treatment and hope out there for. So by being able to intervene and um you know share those resources with young people and make them available to them if they want to access them. It can really be life and trajectory changing. trying to I think his name was Paul that I spoke to yesterday and crazy story is that his father um also was experienced mental health and he said it took 10 years for his father to get help. So you saying that it's like there's there's a problem, right? There truly is. And he actually went into the space of creating something. I think his name was Paul. I can't remember what the organization was with, but um he just mentioned that he created something to help those achieve um help faster because he was realizing he didn't want that to happen to anybody else. And now he kind of got into that teleahalth space. Obviously blew up during the pandemic, but he started it because of experience that he had with his dad. And and so when you said 10 years, it ought to I'm like, what what's his name? I spoke to him recently. Um but wow, that we have that issue. I I do love that we get to talk more openly about mental health because for a very long time it just wasn't something common that we we talked about. Um, I spoke to another organization recently that which I thought was really cool is that their organization what they do is they pay to have um a representative from their organization and I think they they're in like 146 schools and and helping with the mental health and it's almost like that social worker, right? Or just that one-on-one where maybe and they pay for it, not the school. So, I love that we're in a space that mental health truly for a long time we told the kids to leave it at home. We don't talk about this. we didn't shine light on it and now we are shining light more than ever. Um, and that pandemic, you know, there was a lot of bad that happened, but I think just that part in itself was so good that we get to do that and that we don't get we don't just sweep it under the rug anymore because it does make our lives a little bit better when we get to talk about those type of things. And and then when you talk about it, then you realize you're not alone with it as well. A lot of people just think in their minds that they're alone on some of these journeys and in reality they're not. That there's no resources that can help them, but in reality, here we go. Covenant House is actually, you know, putting all their eggs in his basket and says, "Let's break the cycle." So, I I appreciate that. Another thing that I truly enjoy just watching you is every time that I ask you a question, you there's just so much happiness about you. You light up about, you know, some of the things that you guys are doing. What does that mean to you to be in this space to be a advocate for um young children? Um, you know, it's just a privilege and it's a joy. And that go almost brings me back now to one of the things that I love about Covenant House and makes us unique. We've got our mission. We've got principles that guide our work with young people, but we also have some values about how we want to lead as leaders and be a part of our organization. And one of them is joy. Um, and how cool is that to be part of an organization that really lifts that up? And you know, any nonprofit work is hard and grueling. I always say that anyone who works in a nonprofit, you're you're doing the job of probably what would be two to three people in the corporate sector, right? Um, and in the space that we're in in Covenant House, sometimes it can be emotionally taxing and and dark work, too. Um, but there's so much hope in it. There's so much joy in it. And and you have to really be able to find that. And I feel really fortunate that at Covenant House, we very much have that balance. And I have such an incredible group of colleagues as my partners in this work, both at our headquarters and at our sites, who truly bring me joy as well.

[21:49]  That's so cool. and with you pouring into people. One of the biggest things I see as leaders is that we continue to pour into people. Even sometimes when we're completely empty, we forget. No one really teaches us how to pour into us while we're pouring into others. So, with that being said, with you pouring into so many people, when does someone pour into you at just the right time? Do you recall one of those moments where maybe you were a little empty, but you got poured into? Whether it's a story with uh one of the young teens, whether it's a colleague of yours, husband, give us one of those moments.

[22:22]  Yeah. Um I would say I get poured into and and lifted up all the time when I get to hear the stories of our young people and I am fortunate in my role that I get to travel to our sites across our federation all the time. So, I get to see our amazing work really in practice and it just it's it's a beautiful thing to see. Um, so I'll just give an example of I think it's always helpful to share a young person's story and this one actually ties back to the mental health conversation we were just having. Um, so at one of our sites they were serving a young man who came to them and was, you know, in a psychotic episode and was pretty much non-verbal. Other organizations would have required that young person to take medication in order to stay at their site, but we really don't operate that way at Covenant House. We take what we call a one-sizefits- one approach. And we focus really exclusively on building transformational relationships and trust with young people, recognizing that they're the experts in their lives and recognizing that it's going to take time for them to trust us and be able to, you know, work on their path uh to sustainability. So in this case, we met this young man where he was and we provided him with shelter. We met his basic human needs. We really engaged him, but we didn't, you know, force things on him. And we didn't kick him out either for for not doing those things. Eventually, he did um decompensate further and had to be hospitalized.

[24:04]  And when he got out of the hospital, he came back to Covenant House because we were home for him. And couple days later he said, "Hey, I want to call my aunt in Florida." And the team there was like, "What are you talking about?" We had no idea that he had any family, any positive connections to work from. You know, he really had not been very forthcoming before. And anyway, we got him a phone, he called the aunt. Turns out they'd been looking for him and really had just kind of lost him when he became um you know had a psychotic break and just kind of like went off the grid. And we were able to reunite this young man with his family um and you know and then at that point successfully engage him in mental health treatment that then was able to be sustained. And I think if we had really forced that at the outset, he would have left. Yeah.

[25:01]  And who knows what horrors would have happened to him on the street. But instead, you know, we gave him time and we gave him the space and we made the relationships and it worked. And it just shows you again that that bit of hope and the opportunity to get people back on their path.

[25:18]  And I don't think that um enough people understand youth homelessness. What's one thing for those that are listening you wish they actually understood about youth homelessness?

[25:29]  Oh, I think so many people I think are scared of of people who are experiencing homelessness on the street and they look away or they assume they're on drugs um or they're dangerous. And you know, these these young people could be your children. They could be your brother. They could be your cousin, your friend. Um, and really, they just have not had the opportunity. So many of them just haven't had that that one sort of adult to believe in them or just had some unfortunate circumstances where maybe parents, you know, their one parent died or was sent to jail and suddenly they had nowhere to go. um or maybe they had to leave home, you know, based on their sexual orientation or gender identity. But, you know, I think the most important thing to know is that they're just like everyone else and they have hopes and dreams and aspirations and talents and, you know, it's our opportunity to really pour into them and and help them see that future for themselves. Because once you've experienced homelessness, you're not thinking about tomorrow. you're thinking about where am I going to sleep tonight? Where's my next next meal coming from? They aren't really able to see a future for themselves. So, being able to give them the space to start healing from their trauma, healing from, you know, or settle from whatever they've experienced they've just come from. There's there's so much they can give back to the world.

[27:09]  That is true. I actually experienced um he end up passing away, but he was um a young kid. Mom and dad, he had a hell of a story um to really think about, but his mom and dad left to Haiti. Well, I guess he was with his mom. Mom left to Haiti, leaving him, a 5-year-old, and sister, seven-year-old, behind. Um she said she'll come back, never came back. So, of course, now DCF, Department of Children Family gets involved uh because they were homeless. So, now they're separated. And then, you know, he goes on to be this adult, never really working on that trauma, on that mental health that we talked about. By 30 year old, by you know, 30 years old, he ends up passing away. And um like when life was good, he was good, but when life got a little rocky, he just didn't know where to go. And he, you know, that's where all these things I could only imagine came back running. and um to the point that one time I I remember him calling me from one of those um I don't really uh I don't want to say the wrong terminology here but one of those institutes that they just put people that may be a little lost in the head right so this the first time I actually experienced talking to him but knowing that I wasn't talking to him right like he sounded very different it wasn't the same person

[28:24]  but um

[28:25]  but he would only remember the good things and that's how I realized like man he was still stuck on the things that made him and and and it was a lot of the times it was those moments that he grew up with me cuz I by the time he was 18 years old and you know his foster parents wanted to charge him $500 to share a room with four other people. I got involved and I'm young. I'm 19 20 years old at this moment and I said, "Hey man, like I would have you move in with me." I had got this five-bedroom house at 19 years old. Moved in my friends. I said, "You know, you pay $300 a month, but you have to continue your school." He was still in high school. You I'm going to help you get a job. and and he did all that, you know, and he was so happy. And it wasn't until we all separated where life was just a little different. And, you know, sometimes I felt very um bad, but I realized I didn't know mental health was that strong. It wasn't until I also had to overcome some of my, you know, things of sexual abuse and adoption. I realized like, man, these things could really make or break somebody,

[29:20]  you know. So that's why I love Leslie the work that you're doing and how we're highlighting mental health at that young of an age because I've also had a brother that grew up on on pills his you know through his whole teen years. I mean really from his whole childhood from maybe like 10 to 15 16 when he decided he just wasn't going to take them anymore. Um so it I I hear you. I hear some of the things you're saying. It it resonates a lot with me and I'm happy that you kind of just mentioned when it comes to our home youth homelessness they're just people. They're human. they they just need someone to love them, to care for them, to to be there for them sometimes to just as you mentioned, meet them where they're at. You know, it helps them feel seen and heard. But I also want you to speak to your frontline team. I'm pretty sure that you guys are going to be sharing this throughout Covenant House and all the different locations. When we talk to our frontline team, these are people that are actually doing some of the hardest, rawest uh moments out on the front line. What do you say to them right now if they're listening? Oh, I I hope if they're listening, they couldn't see me light up when you asked me that question. Um, so I want them to know that. Um, but really just want to say thank you. These are the people who work at Covenant House are among the most spectacular human beings I have ever met in my life, will ever meet in my life. And really, it's just such a privilege to work alongside them. They have such grace, such love, and so much capacity um for doing really hard work. But, you know, goes back to like pouring into people um and and making a difference in young people's lives. When we think about um you know, what is the secret sauce of our work at Covenant House, it's relationship. And these people are just experts in building relationships with young people, trust with young people, and really using that to trans help young people transform their lives. And so, you know, they show up, they work doubles. I've been in trainings where people are coming in often overnight um and they're showing up to be trained the next day. I mean, they're just relentless in their commitment to our work and support for our young people. So, they are heroes and angels, I would say.

[31:43]  I love that. And I love that you said making a difference. Sometimes people just do it out of the love, out of the pure purpose that they feel that they have on this uh earth. And and truly, they don't know they're making a difference. they're making a complete difference, you know, and hope that even the stories that come from me come from you that they realize like, wow, I'm a part of just a small chapter of what it looks like to really change someone's life. Some people just truly do and don't even know they're doing it, you know? That's it's crazy. It's pretty cool too because we do um we're building a bit of an alumni network and so you're really able to then see young people who were at Covenant House whether it was 5 years ago, 10 years ago, 30 years ago and it just is such a beautiful demonstration of how the seeds you plant today can just reap such beautiful gardens later.

[32:32]  Yeah. And some people don't even realize that you're planting seeds as you mentioned. And I love that you said that these are seeds being planted. Um, somebody may hit rock bottom and it's not on your watch, but they remember what you said. And that be the game changer. Like, oh my god, I remember when Leslie said or I remember when Peter said, um, yeah, those seeds are truly planted. I felt like that in my life when I was, you know, now that I'm 35 and I think about all the things I had to overcome. I could go back to those moments that really were impacts of something someone said. And a lot of times it's not your family. is some stranger you meet out in the street. Which is why it's so important when you see someone out there that is experiencing some of these things to pour into them whether it's just allowing them to be seen.

[33:13]  Yep.

[33:14]  Have a good day. Hope all is good. You know,

[33:16]  so uh I love that Leslie and unfortunately this is a great conversation but we're already almost at the deadline here. I want to make sure I respect your time. So I want to jump in right into this blind question that we had for from our last leader. Are you ready for this?

[33:28]  I think so.

[33:31]  All right. What's that one belief that's carried you through every leadership leadership season, even when the room got quiet?

[33:40]  Oh, that's a good question. Um, I I think it's just the leaning in and the hard work and the tenacity, right? You've got to sometimes things can seem daunting. Sometimes they can seem scary, but um you know really not being deterred and always you know finding your way through finding finding the solution and being led truly by mission. What's the right thing to do?

[34:11]  Love it. And what is your blind question for the next leader we have here on the heart and hustle?

[34:15]  I would say um who are your role models or mentors and what have you learned from them?

[34:22]  Okay, I like that. Okay, listen. You have been phenomenal, but we can't leave without letting people know where to find you guys. Are you guys on social? What is the website? What socials are we on? So those that may want some information, they can actually connect with you.

[34:36]  Terrific. Um, so if you don't know, the best place to start is at www.covenanthouse.org. We're also on Instagram and Facebook and, you know, can find all of us there. If you live in a location where we have a covenant house, um you brick and mortar, you can volunteer. Um certainly you can donate. And one of my favorite things to always suggest to people is that we have an annual sleepout fundraiser. And this is one night where you give up your bed in solidarity with young people experiencing homelessness and you raise money and awareness for Covenant House. and it is the most impactful fundraiser, certainly an experience that I've ever participated in. So, that's something that you can learn more about on our website, too.

[35:26]  How many people show up to to these sleepovers?

[35:29]  Oh, um there we have them across all of our locations. Thousands and thousands of people.

[35:36]  Oh, so you guys do it all at once for the

[35:39]  Yes. So, there's multiple events throughout the year. So, you can do it at a covenant house, but you could also do it in your backyard or or where.

[35:46]  Got it. Got it. Oh, that's so cool. No, that's so cool. Um, and I love that you said it doesn't have to be a physical location. You could just support by and making sure we there's probably a hashtag or something people need to um Yeah, go to the website, find out some. It's actually really good. Now, not a lot of people get creative. I think that was really creative what you guys have been doing and thinking outside the box. So, Leslie, we appreciate you guys. Are you on LinkedIn?

[36:07]  I am.

[36:08]  Are you active?

[36:09]  I'm in houses. Okay, cool. So, connect with her on LinkedIn if you guys want to know more information. Covenant House is also on LinkedIn. Uh, any any social that we can possibly give out, but also to just connect with a leader like yourself that you know is just been doing this for so long and have so much insight. Um, there might be some young aspiring leaders that say, you know what, I resonate with Leslie. How can I connect with her? So, uh, LinkedIn would definitely be that. But we we appreciate you. We appreciate your time. We appreciate just how how you've just given us so much insight on what Covenant House is doing and we hope to continue to see it grow. We know I think you mentioned earlier it was I'm so bad with numbers. Is it 17? You said

[36:44]  18 coming in house of

[36:45]  18. Oh man, it was 18. So close now that you have 18. I can't wait till the next time you tell me it's 25 or that you know things are expanding. So I'm definitely going to connect with you on LinkedIn. But guys, if you guys haven't already, the way that we get the message out, the word, the resources, um you have to share, like, comment, right? If you know someone that may be experiencing some of these things that we've talked about that you actually tag them in the comments so they can hear great conversations. If there's any aspiring leaders that want to get into the space of nonprofits, I think we don't have these conversations enough. Here goes Leslie letting you know that it's a great place to be. You know, come and and spend one hour, spend two hours. There's not a minimum amount of time you can actually spend with a nonprofit. They're always looking for people that just wants to give back their time. It doesn't always have to be a monetary thing. Um, as you mentioned, they have things such as sleeping outside for one day. It doesn't take much to be a part of a change. Leslie, we thank you so much. My name is Benny Fra. This has been the amazing Leslie. We'll catch you guys on the next episode. Lers. Thank you.