Topher Hansen on Big Audacious Goals, Mental Health, and Leading with Purpose

[0:00]  This guy was 52 years old at the time. And he said, "At the uh uh when I started to learn about that, for the first time in my life, I saw tomorrow. I had hoped that I would be alive tomorrow because up to this point, I always figured I'd be dead tomorrow." And uh I've always sort of lived that hopeless life uh because it was out of control and no one was helping me to understand what was going on until I came here because one of the things Centerpoint does is integrate mental health and substance together.

[0:40]  Not side by side but but lace it together. So it is how it lives in our body. It's all addressing each other in their body. physical health, mental health, substance use, uh primary care issues, all those kinds of things are all talking to each other in our body. And so we try and address care in a way that's uh similar to that, integrated and holistic. And so uh anyway, he he then uh so he's telling his story and saying, you know, for the first time in my life, I saw tomorrow. And I'm like I'm cry I'm sitting there on the on the counter in this room crying at what he's saying cuz it was gigantic. I mean in life, right? That's life right there.

[1:27]  And that guy was facing it. Welcome back to another episode here on the Heart and Hustle podcast. Today we have another great leader and listen, we were offline already talking for the last 10 minutes and I'm like, wait a minute, Turfer, we we we have too much good stuff already talking about. Can we just start off with your rules, man? You had a conversation with your fellas yesterday. Tell us a little bit about it and I want to know those rules because I think they were really good rules that people should be listening to. So, the the the topic of conversation was how do you take people who are really bright and kind of go-getters anyway and then uh get them uh hooked into what they're

[2:18]  really good at so they launch and I mean these are 18 year olds and uh they're coming in and they're brighteyed and bushy tailed and ready to go and how do we engage them and so we were having that conversation uh and and so in the course of that then I have several rules that I kind of think about in life like uh that you ought to apply this as the background of your life and that I've learned over time um and uh and the first is uh to be happy and uh so do Daly Lama the wise man Daly Lama said the he boiled it all down said the purpose in life is to be happy and uh and So it it that conversation in and of

[3:07]  itself could take an hour, but I'm not going to do that. It I'm just going to say first thing you need to do is figure out how to be happy in your world because if you find happy, the rest will follow out of that. So uh so first first is to be happy. Second is to uh develop your brain. uh this thing, this computer up here is mind-boggling, so to speak, and and uh we don't begin to tap it. So, begin to tap it and develop it and help it do some work for you. So, within your happy, you're really you've got a great tool that's going. Uh the third rule is find your your rapture. So ancient

[3:54]  religion talks about in Sanskrit talks about rapture and uh which is a term I love but you can use the word passion. It's the same kind of thing. Uh but find that thing and you'll know it when you find it. Everybody has one. Yeah. Find that thing that you go, "Oh, this is this is what I was born to do." Uh kind of thing. And you know you're in your element. You're you're good in it. You know it. You get it. all those kinds of things and it don't feel like work. It doesn't feel like right it's it's fun, right? Uh so the fourth rule is do the hard work. Um so that is understand what it is to be gritty to dig. Uh so if you've ever done an extremely

[4:42]  challenging sport and you think I'm done and then you dig another level deeper that's the hard work. Uh if you've had an intellectual challenge, work challenge, school challenge, whatever it is, and you've had to push and push and push and really understand what hard is, then uh you're doing the hard work, and that uh sculpts you that uh iron on iron and uh and that's what helps uh sculpt and develop you. And and then the the the fifth one is don't get in your own way. We all have terrible self-t talk.

[5:23]  We're our own worst critics. We're always our own worst enemy. And uh nobody is worse to us than we are really. And and so don't get in your own way. Free yourself up to take the rest of that and go. And if you do, uh it'll be fun. you'll be productive as uh you could imagine. Uh whatever vision you have, you'll go right by it. Uh because you have so much good energy uh propelling you in the direction that you choose. Uh so those those are five rules we talked about. How do you instill those five rules in an 18-year-old person coming into the university to start this whole thing in

[6:13]  life uh and get them going anyway and and I kind of want to do that in my work setting too, you know, is I want people in my work setting to be in the element that they're best suited and then they will do the best work. So, and I think I love that conversation. One thing I love about the conversation that you have people to have the conversation with because not a lot of times can you have those conversations with people like-minded individuals. So everything you said I think is is dead on. But then also finding people that are not just yesmen people that I can actually relate to these conversations and I think that's where people don't have uh especially when you're in that CEO when you're in that uh leader space so many times you don't have that connection with someone to be so open. So, I love that you were kind of open and I would

[6:59]  also kind of say it is very hard to get someone to think a little bit differently, especially at 18. But even when you're 30ome, 40ome, you've been comfortable for all those years. But I've seen great leaders like yourself that will take someone kind of go into an organization, see that someone may not have the skills to do what they're doing at the best of their ability, but they're really good at some something else. And a lot of times they are a little nervous, they're upset, but you hear it all the time like, "Man, thank God that you put me here. I love it. I didn't even know I enjoyed this." And it all could also start with volunteering.

[7:33]  Maybe go volunteer your time to just see, you know, that creative idea that you have that maybe your job is not allowing you to go do. Do it at a nonprofit. Whether it's social media, whether, you know, leading, uh, whatever that may look like, there's nonprofits that need your assistance, which is why this is so good. And that's my story.

[7:51]  Yeah, this is so good because because when I got going in the world, uh I uh I was in the space, the mental health and substance space that I am now. But then I, you know, I thought, oh, that's not my future. Uh and so I went to law school and uh then got out and practiced law for eight years. Well, in the course of those eight years, you know, I I was a a a a partner in a law firm. I, you know, was doing trial work and just all this stuff, but I wasn't happy at all. I I mean, it was not a satisfying. I could not feel the fact that this was ringing my bell. Like, I'm just like, I I don't This doesn't do anything for me. And what did that moment actually look like?

[8:38]  I mean, you walk Well, it was a long moment. It was many years. And you know, and at some point, you know, I I I I loyalty is important to me. And uh so at some point I said, "Okay, I got to hang with this. I got to stick with this. I got to really give it its all and try and and make sure." And so, you know, I I gave myself five years. Well, at five years, I I wasn't happy. And I was doing it. that I I was hitting all the markers in terms of partnership and money and all those things, but but it wasn't satisfying to me. Uh at the end of the day, I wasn't a happy guy. And so, uh I I I sort of dug and I said, uh you know, this is the the space that I was in in the mental health

[9:26]  and substance volunteering um uh and even employed a little bit um uh before law school. I said that was where I was happiest and uh and but I thought you know there's no future in that for me. Uh and then uh and then a job opened up and I thought well okay I could do that job back at the little tiny company. I mean it we we were a $900,000 annual budget. Um you know and you know now that's two and a half payrolls for me. That's not even a budget. That's two payrolls. Um and and so uh I I left being a partner in a law firm and went to this because I said

[10:15]  that is the place that resonated inside of me and I thought what am I doing? Uh I'm leaving as a partner in a law firm. I'm recently divorced. I have two young kids and I just thought oh what am I doing? But I said, I'll tell you what, I never look back. Yeah. Uh I got into it.

[10:35]  Those moments though, those moments when you feel like that, you got to keep going. You got to keep going. That's that's when it takes the courage to follow the journey, you know. And I tell that to people all the time. Be willing to take the journey and to listen to yourself and and follow that. And and I did. Um and that was uh 32 years ago.

[10:59]  And uh and then seven years after I started, I became CEO. I've been CEO for 25 years. And uh I'm retiring in eight weeks. It's crazy. This is crazy talk, man. You're not retired. People say they retire and they'll get right back to what they're doing. Maybe at the volunteer level. You're not going anywhere. Oh, no. I will. I'll I I'll go. And because I've got uh belief uh thoughts about that and but also life is uh uh a huge piece and my piece right now with my work and all that is about this big and I get to do cool stuff but life is so much bigger than that. And so this is going to give me an opportunity to uh to to go discover the rest of the

[11:49]  pie and have fun. I got a question. Looking back, what did that big pivot actually teach you about um how you define success? Well, success is right here. That's easy. Uh so back back to my rules, start with happy. Uh if you're happy, uh then uh I don't care what it is. Uh it doesn't have to be, you know, doing my career and being the CEO of a company. It it can be uh uh whatever it is in life that resonates with you deeply where you're just in it and you feel it and you're at home in it and uh and and that's your sweet spot. Uh and so um very few things uh are are are um uh fully explored with just being in

[12:43]  happy that's why I say uh develop your brain do the hard work uh those kinds of things because that helps shape and develop and grow that in a way that uh can benefit you and uh oftentimes the rest of the world. So, uh, but but the moment, so my moment in that law office, uh, was about one, I don't care if your neighbor's fence is two feet too far over, and two, I have to do something that makes me happy inside. And so going on that journey uh and sort of running into that again was the pivotal moment where I stepped out and again thought

[13:31]  what am I doing but uh it was the best thing I ever did and uh it I I sort of have developed my vision over time but the wildest vision I have had I sailed right by And uh and the projects I've done are uh way bigger than I ever imagined. And uh but I was willing to explore and take the journey, do the hard work, take the challenge, uh develop my brain, and stay in my happy.

[14:07]  And as you said, it's not work. Uh I I mean, when I'm doing all this stuff, I'm in my element and just having fun doing all of it. And that's why I've uh you know I I I turned 70 in 9 weeks. And uh I I and that's why I've worked this long in part is uh because I've had so many fun things to do and have gotten them all done. Now I'm actually just finishing the last project I sort of set out in my brain about I needed to do this. And so I'm just about to get done with that.

[14:48]  and then uh and then I'll hand it over to the next team because that's part of in my work that's part of what's important is and in life is going out on top uh you know we all think of that in boxing you know you know go out on top um or golf or whatever it is uh um and and so this is that where I've really done my stuff but the the next group is really ready to gra they are grabbing on to this. They're smart. They're dedicated. Uh they uh feel it inside and they're ready to go. And so I'm trying not to get in their way and let them experience their passion. Uh they're all already very smart, all of them. And so

[15:37]  to just let them go and me not be their impediment. Uh, so that that's kind of what this is the retirement's about and why I will one of the reasons I'll disappear is I can't be their shadow. I have to be I have to let them explore and do their own thing and uh and I'm going to go do my own thing.

[15:59]  You know, one thing that that caught my attention earlier you said and just came back to me was um you gave yourself a time frame. You said uh I think it was in the law office, five years. How important is it for you to put a time frame? Because I did the same thing, right? I put a time frame and if I can't do this, if I'm not happy here, I have to walk away because it's so important.

[16:19]  And I tell you why I walked away. I It was already the two-year mark. I was there a little later than the two years that I gave myself. I was already unhappy. And I caught myself just talking about it at out at dinner. I was at Texas Roadhouse with my wife and I'm talking about and venting about work. At that moment, I realized and I'm driving an hour to work, you know? So all that just added up, right? And um it was a hard very it was a very hard decision.

[16:42]  But I told myself, I'm doing this for two years. I asked myself, what was in it for me? What am I taking out? What's going to make me better? Can imagine you took a lot of things that made you better, right, as a leader? But how important was that for you to give yourself a time frame um as you look back to it? Well, that it was important to me for my integrity. I I said earlier that I I have to feel like I gave it my all uh and had that loyalty value uh uh fully explored and then also I think that converts over to my integrity and so I just felt like that was necessary but but I was doing what you were doing that that you know when you find yourself just talking about it randomly uh then you know you're unhappy you know

[17:32]  that that you got to change things up a little bit. And so, um, but but I felt like I really had to give it my all, uh, in order to feel good about making the switch. After all, I'd invested. I mean, because I'd gone three years of law school, that cost money, you know, I'd been involved in this partnership in the law firm and all these things. And so, I don't want to just drop it and walk away on a whim. uh I want to really give it its worth and and so that that was why uh I sort of set the time frame with my own career. Uh I set a time frame to I sort of calculate I'm not kidding. This goes back probably seven years or so. Uh where I took on a giant project that

[18:20]  that took me that many years. Uh and uh and I I then started thinking about, oh well, this is going to take a long time and I'll get done. Well, I'll just work till 70. That'll be like a year after I kind of get it done and that'll let me do this other project and then I'll be out. And so I've really had this calculated for a long time. Uh I'm just getting to the end of it now. So Got it.

[18:47]  I want to talk on your leadership skills because you did walk into Center Point from a $3 million to an $18 million. That is no easy task. It goes show to your leadership and the work that you put in. But let's be real, growth isn't always uh sexy. What was that one holy crap moment that uh can we pull this off? Came into mind because a lot of times while you're doing something, whether whether you see it or not, you still have those moments. Um what did that look like especially drawing scaling up? Yeah.

[19:15]  Um so uh you know it it it's part of uh you know so so the project I did was a a real estate development that I found a uh 53,000 square foot building that was not being used uh and uh we uh developed it into an outpatient and residential apartments and conference center and things like that. And uh it it's one of 14 buildings that we operate, but it's it's the big one. And so it's now uh it's now a 60,000 square foot building and it's gorgeous. And uh we have a well-being garden we call it,

[20:03]  but it's really a park in the back uh that has an amphitheater and labyrinth and raised garden beds and talking circles and you know so it's really really a cool place. Um but that was that was the big hairy audacious that was the biggest hairy audacious goal I've ever taken on. And I wondered uh did I just catch the car kind of thing.

[20:29]  Um uh because I I knew I could get some uh like we did low-income housing tax credits for about half of it, but then the other half was going to be uh fundraising, $13.5 million. Um and we'd never done that. I'd already always operated our business to stand on its own two feet and never really needed to do the capital. So all of a sudden I'm going from not having done it to I'm going to raise 13.5 million dollars. And I thought, "Oh my god." And uh and uh but you know, the the timing was all perfect actually uh uh for that. And but you know it just took courage frankly uh and uh I mean I don't I don't sort of

[21:18]  tout myself as the courageous guy but uh but here I the the community needed it uh the organization needed it um uh and this building and the the whole thing was possible. The question is, could I pull it off? And uh and there were times where I stood where I went there by myself and I thought, what did I get into? And then and then on the heels of that those thoughts went, no, we're going to do this. I know the details on this. We can pull this off. and and ultimately the thing that really was gratifying out of it was as I went to the community to raise the the money and in Lincoln, Nebraska, raising $13.5 million is a trick. Uh because it's not

[22:07]  it it's not a community that just pours out the millions kind of thing. And so, but this was the it was 2020 uh where we got going and were raising money in in the front end of the COVID pandemic. Um what was ended up being true that we worried about was bank accounts were actually flush. Uh the investments were up. Uh and so that helped. uh everybody knew our data because uh you know like last year we served uh 5,200 people and 54% of those 5200 uh check the box I make zero to $1,000 a year. So that means zero. Uh so the population we serve is ex uh no money to

[22:57]  low income. Um they they know the work we do. were all over the place in the communities and uh and so when I went out to the community, they said, "Uh, no, our bank accounts are flush. We believe in you and what you're doing in the community, and this is a great project. Uh, we're going to support it."

[23:20]  And I had two people who doubled the amount they gave us from what I asked them for. So that Wow. you know, so so that that was a a really gratifying result of, you know, I did the hard work up front. I I I I knew in my heart that what we had here was a doable project.

[23:44]  Uh but every once in a while my brain would go, "Are you sure?" And but but it all was affirmed over and over and over. And so right now we uh the building is all done. We have zero debt on the building. And uh and we are fully operational. I mean we have more and more people. Our outpatient services went up 18% last year alone. Um uh because more and more people are walking in the door needing help and we do a great job helping people. So hey, real quick, have you enjoyed the podcast? We first want to say thank you and we also just want to give you a little insight of what we're up to at Francis. Some even realize that we're working with organizations to help them use AI to create that real human

[24:33]  communication experiences where that's actually supporting your your families, those patients or the entire community. We're actually creating tech that connects. Check it out. Francis.ai. You you just you just mentioned that um some folks come in, they're living on less than $1,000, could be zero in this case, truly survival mode. What does what does care actually really even look like when someone's starting from rock bottom and coming into your organization? Yeah, that that that's really an important question uh because uh the answer is you meet them where they are. So care looks like whatever they need where they are. And so if they're uh on the ground in the community on a sidewalk or something

[25:21]  like that, you get down on the ground with them and start talking to them and asking questions because it's about them and what they need. And so the care starts with them. It starts with meeting them where they are. And then uh and then you begin to build relationship and trust. Uh so they'll begin to take steps with you, not big giant leaps, but little baby steps forward and uh and the first day it may be let's go get you something uh to eat and things like that. And so you just start that process. Uh so we have six full-time people in Lincoln, Nebraska that uh do street outreach. Uh and uh so they're

[26:11]  under the bridges uh in the encampments, in the soup kitchens, uh um in the libraries, uh all over the community uh helping uh people who were in need. In fact, we have a pretty unique program. Uh whereas if people uh in the community see somebody on the street, uh they can call 911 or the police non-emergency number and say, "Hey, I've got somebody over here on the sidewalk and they they look like they need some help. Uh and if there's not an obvious law violation or um indication of violence, then uh the 911 dispatcher actually dispatches our team uh out to that person. So then we can meet them where they are. It sort of

[27:03]  decriminalizes being on the street uh which the person on the street appreciates. It saves the law enforcement uh two officers for about one hour's time and and so it's a winwinwin win all the way around and uh and so what so that's the beginning of the process and then as I said then you take the baby steps forward uh and then Maslo told us nobody gets better on the street food shelter clothing uh basic needs you got to take care of those things early on. And so we have we operate over 200 apartments in Lincoln uh the and some of them are uh right off the street into an apartment type place.

[27:51]  So we get them shelter and we start getting them squared away and taken care of and then continue those baby steps forward to help them begin to tackle some of the bigger issues which often are mental health and substance use. So you guys are doing amazing. Did you have a story that really still sticks with you? I know you have plenty of them, but one that comes to mind on someone that has really came at their lowest but completely left a changed individual in indeed. Yeah. And and for all those in the business, uh uh this person gave permission to for me to tell the story while he was alive. Um he's deceased now. Um but uh so I'll call him Harry.

[28:34]  and uh he showed up at our door um uh with a garbage bag of everything he had in his life. He had a garbage bag with all his possessions. That was it. And he said, "I just got off the bus from Ohio and they said I could get help here." Well, the reason that he came here was in the general vicinity were family members. Uh and so they uh for whatever reason they put him on the bus. Uh sometimes we call that bus therapy for the city. We're just going to get him out of here. Uh kind of thing, which isn't the right thing to do, but uh that's how he got to us on the bus with a bag. Uh so he said, "Yeah, that you could give us help." So we went down. We got him squared away. uh about um uh oh

[29:25]  about a year year and a half or so. Yeah, it was about a year later. Um I'm in a residential program and uh and we're s and and I'm just sitting in listening and uh mind you I had already been doing this for teen years. Uh, so I had a lot of experience and uh and so the group is going around and and they're talking about why this place was important to them and that guy said, "I've been in treatment in seven other states and nobody ever told me that I had a mental health issue that was impacting my substance use." And as I started to learn about that, and this guy was 52 years old at the time, and he said, "At the uh uh when I started to

[30:16]  learn about that, for the first time in my life, I saw tomorrow. I had hoped that I would be alive tomorrow because up to this point, I always figured I'd be dead tomorrow." And uh I've always sort of lived that hopeless life. uh because it was out of control and no one was helping me to understand what was going on until I came here because one of the things centerpoint does is integrate mental health and substance together not side by side but but lace it together so it is how it lives in our body. It's all addressing each other in their body.

[30:58]  physical health, mental health, substance use, uh primary care issues, all those kinds of things are all talking to each other in our body. And so we try and address care in a way that's uh similar to that, integrated and holistic. And so uh anyway, he he then uh so he's telling his story and saying, you know, for the first time in my life, I saw tomorrow. And I'm like I'm cry I'm sitting there on the on the counter in this room crying at what he's saying cuz it was gigantic. I mean in life, right? That's life right there.

[31:35]  And that guy was facing it. So then the cool thing was about uh six or nine months later uh uh I'm I'm coming into the facility, this particular facility, and two guys are walking out and I sort of looked at him. I didn't recognize him really and said hi. And and then the one of them said, "Toe."

[31:59]  And uh and I looked at him and I looked more closely at him and it was Harry. And I said, "Harry, oh my god, you're like the most beautiful man for two miles around. He he had a a suit on, an overcoat, scarf, uh had his hair done nice. Uh and and you know, the important thing is then I I looked at him in the eye and he had health in his eyes. He was vibrant and vital in his eyes. And I said, "What are you doing?" And he said, "I came back to the residential group to say thank you because they saved my life." He said, 'Now, I'm I'm living in an apartment. I'm out uh looking for jobs. My So, the family that was in the

[32:49]  area, well, they all had restraining orders against him, uh because he was such a beast when he was using uh and had uncontrolled mental health issues and so on. So, uh he said, uh I'm back with all my family, uh have relationship with them. I mean, it was it was as cool as cool gets. And uh anyway, uh so then we talked for a little while and he went on uh so there's one le lesson left in this and that is um about a year later.

[33:25]  I I didn't run into it. I think I saw him one other time, but other than that, I didn't run into him much. Uh but about a year later, somebody came into my office and said, "Toe, I just," this is Friday afternoon, late, and they said, "Uh, I just learned that Harry went into hospice." And I said, "Hospice? What?"

[33:42]  And they said, they went to the dock and he has stage four cancer and uh things are bad and he went into hospice. And I said, "Oh man, I got to go see him on Monday is what I said." So um that was my plan. So Monday uh comes that guy who told me walks in my office first thing Monday morning and said Harry died over the weekend. And I said h so not only did I feel sad for all that but uh uh but also do it when you can do it. You don't say Monday, you know, if it's Friday afternoon, I learned about it. I should have gone then. Um, and and so I've learned that lesson in life. Do it while you can do it. And uh, but the the

[34:31]  thing I I always think back on, and I know this was important to Harry, was he was so happy to be in recovery and uh, attaining the trappings of life uh, that he wanted. And so that was a cool deal. Um, yeah. No, he was happy. Right. You go back to that one rule, be happy. Oh, and he was Oh, you can see it in his eyes. Happiness. It was in his eyes.

[34:56]  Yeah. Uh, man, this is so good. I can't believe that we've been talking as long as we have. And I I honestly had a whole bunch of questions and this has just kind of been so improvised. Um, you're actually receiving a lifetime achievement award here soon. And congrats, by the way. Thank you. But what still keeps you up at night about the state of mental health care? That is so important to you. You've been talking about it. You you from the beginning.

[35:19]  Well, it uh right now in particular where talks about cutting Medicaid and uh that ripples out not just to the people getting care but uh jobs and community and and uh oh, it just it's a giant rock in the pond uh to make any cuts to Medicaid. Um anyway, um the the thing that uh is that is the fragility of it because I see so many people getting help that they couldn't get help before. They've never they haven't been to a primary care person for their whole life. Uh and uh you know, Harry's a great example. Harry had not been to one. Finally, when he went to one uh because he was having some issues, they said, "You've got stage four cancer."

[36:06]  So, uh, you know, we've got to address those kinds of things early on and, uh, Medicaid is is what helps that. So now different than all the years I've done it up until about 2 or 3 years ago um uh is that the um finances are such that I have to raise money every single month um and each year just to make ends meet so we don't go broke. I mean, uh, we used to be able to clear a two or three, uh, percent margin on top and now we're we're right at zero. And, uh, so everything we're bringing in of $18 million, we're spending, uh, for staffing and just all the complexity of

[36:55]  of operating a big business. you know, we have I probably have a dozen IT platforms we operate off of uh for all the different needs because if you're going to be in high level business, uh it you know, you've got to have all the equipment, right? And uh and so just to have all that costs money and so it's tight. It is super tight. And it's not just Centerpoint, it's all the organizations like ours, it's hospitals.

[37:22]  I know the critical access hospitals in Nebraska are all either at zero or underwater and uh and you know that's that's lifelines for communities. So I worry about the health care system as a whole and that uh what we're doing is uh squeezing it for money really. Uh um and what we need to do is set up the priority of health care being an entitlement for everybody where you get your health care. We want you healthy.

[37:56]  And one of our taglines is healthy minds and bodies, strong communities. If you have people who have healthy brains and healthy bodies, you're going to have a vital strong community. And and so uh we are at a point now that is as challenging as any point I've seen in 32 years. And which says a lot. Like I said, I've had some pretty thin months uh on making the whole thing work, but I always made the whole thing work. And now we're having to go out and raise money to make the whole thing work. And the funders who normally said we don't give operational dollars, we give capital dollars or program dollars, we don't give money to operations. That

[38:45]  tune has changed across the board. Now organizations are giving operations dollars because they understand how pressed everybody is. Um so you know it really ba it it raises the question for all of us uh which is how important is our health care in our society? What's our policy as a society about being healthy and vital so we can go to school, so we can do the work, uh, you know, just be with family, do all the things, do podcasts. Um, you know, you got to be healthy to do it. And, uh, and so, uh, I think it's really raising that question for us. And, uh, there are big forces behind keeping it the way it is.

[39:35]  Uh but I think we need to start pressing on what the questions are. So uh yeah, I hear I I hear that from a lot of organizations, right? Just the cuts that are happening and everyone feeling it and and being kind of as you mentioned tapped and what that really is going to look like. You know, you're you're cutting a lot of these funds and then people got to go back to where they kind of started at which is not good because now you talk about uh Harry, he's going to start to think or people going to start to think they don't believe in us.

[40:02]  We don't have this opportunity. when there's organizations that want but just can't afford at the moment because of the government cut. So, I definitely hear you. I think another thing that I I hear is that and then I hear that there's a shift in the health care space when it comes to AI and how that's actually um at least alleviating a couple of different things for different people. Yeah, we there's might be cuts within organizations because we can't uh fund a a someone's salary, but how do we help those that are are staying with us and making their jobs easier? Are you guys implementing AI? Is that something that you guys even thought of as as you're on your way out? Yeah. Uh so we've uh got one toe in the water but there again uh with you know with some things like when you're you know just drafting documents or things like that you can use AI to give you a base

[40:49]  document and then well for instance we had a we had a report due and it was like 38 pages uh and the report and and the people came back and said oh no we need on the front end we need an executive summary of this and we thought, "Oh my god, we've got to take 38 pages and write now an executive summary that does it all."

[41:14]  Well, we loaded it into chat GPT and I'm not kidding, in 3 seconds. Boom. And not only was it we read through it, it was perfect. And and not only that, it was laid out nice, you know, bullet pointed and all this stuff. It's amazing. Um the other thing it does is so like uh in a um therapy session then if you have the record on the AI uh then will listen to the therapy session and write the note and then what the therapist does is go back and and and what some places do and we like to do is have it be collaborative. So you actually take both the therapist and the person in therapy and you both look at

[42:03]  it to say, "Is this what you think we talked about?" Yep. And and you both sign off on it. Then it's very collaborative in that uh but it not only uh kind of goes through the gist of what the conversation is, but it also knows then what the assessment was, what the treatment plan is. Uh and then in Medicaid for instance, they call it the golden thread that you have to follow those elements. So you can't just go talk about rebuilding cars uh in your session if that's not in your assessment and your plan and all those things. And so AI attract so it's it's a marvelous tool in those ways, but that costs money uh to do stuff like that. So, you know, it's it's that kind of bind and we've

[42:50]  looked at those things, but right now we just don't have the money uh to to do it. I I love the idea. Um it would make uh the workload different for therapists that they'd be able to really focus more on therapy, see more people uh and then just check their work. You always got to check it. It's sort of like, you know, when you're out with maps in your car, you know, and if it goes turn left and you go, there is not a left turn there, you know. So, you got to you got to backseat drive it a little bit, but uh but it really is a a timesaver and a help. Uh and and the possibilities are unreal. Um yeah, so we're coming to an end here, man. After June 30th, for the first time in 30 years, there's no

[43:38]  calendar. There's no board meetings. What is that really doing for your spirit right now? Oh, I'm I'm excited because you know why? Because uh I'm going to have a big party. So, there's that. And never wrong with that. What a good party. And then and then I'm going to have another party right afterwards because a friend of our son who is like a kind of a son to us, he's getting married and we love him and we love the woman he's marrying. So that'll be fun.

[44:08]  And then the very next day is July 4th and we always have a party on July 4th. Oh, you're partying up. And and then on the 5th, my son is getting married, so we're having a a shower for him and his fiance. And uh and then about four days later, I take off on about a month-long tour of the uh I'm going all the way up to Seattle and uh then I'll drop down to LA, Palm Springs, Phoenix, uh New Mexico, and Colorado, and home. So, yes.

[44:44]  And and then I'm going to go to the UCLA Nebraska football game out at UCLA. And so, you're ready, man. You're ready. I've got So, I And that's just the first six months. I love it. I can't I can't wait to hear the stories on all that, all the things that you've done. And I guess I'm gonna have to stop by and see you on one of my other car tours. Yeah, let let me know, man. Let me know. This is going to be great. Um, where can people find more about the organization, more about yourself? Is it website? What is a website? Social media. What does that look like? Yeah. So, uh, Centerpoint is the organization and it's, uh, like it sounds except there's an e on the end of point. And, uh, so in Lincoln, Nebraska, uh, you you'll find a bunch of centerpoints, but we're a a

[45:31]  treatment program in Lincoln, Nebraska, centerpoint.org. And uh and that's the you know where you can see about co-occurring whole whole health care uh and all the uh philosophical approaches that we take uh with our uh model of care uh harm reduction uh we're we're really on the front edge of what's going on uh in this space. Uh so uh that um me uh I don't know uh Google me toeer Hansen Google me so we're now set to the blind question here man and actually um I always go through different leaders and just pick questions but I felt like this question almost was meant for you after this conversation. Okay. What are you doing to take care of yourself so you can be

[46:19]  available for others? And this was from Debbie another leader but I thought it was a good question for yourself. Oh, I I I I got this. I know you do. So, I I I live about 95 plus percent of my time in happy and uh I always enjoy like I love this with what we're doing. I live in happy. And so that that frees me up uh to be available for other people. And and so one of the things I'll do is go out and when I go get a cup of coffee, I'll buy coffee for somebody. I don't know them. I'll just buy like I'll jump to the person in front or the person behind and say, "Let me buy you whatever you're getting." And and then I meet them and talk to them. It's a great injection of energy to me, to them. Uh it it changes what you're doing. And uh

[47:10]  so I try to practice being happy and living intentionally that way. Let me I'll give uh for your listeners a great reference. Lori Santos uh who's a professor at Yale has uh uh two things. She has a course on the internet on the Corsera Learning Platform. So if you just Google the science of well-being, Lori Santos, you'll come into it. And she also does a podcast called the Happiness Lab. So Lori does a great job in helping uh people understand what happiness is about, how not to torture your brain, how not to like go into those negative moments, false references, anticipation, all those things. And how to intentionally

[47:59]  live in a more positive, happy way. And so, uh, I I have and I've read books on ha on happiness and, you know, I I've kind of dug into it and and so then I practice it. And, uh, I'm telling you, I very little of my life is in not happy. Um and so when you do that as you kind of said it it makes you available uh to others to be uh that a person to be helpful and uh so I and and you know who are we to second guess Doll Daly Lama the purpose in life is to be happy a friend of mine said said toer it is not it's to be there for your community it's to do good deeds it's to and he had

[48:48]  about half a dozen things and I said, "Yeah, but Gary, when you're done doing that, what are you?" Yeah. And he went, "I'm happy." Toeer, I I I ask you, what is the blind question that you have for the next lead? I can only have I can only imagine it's going to be a great blind question for the next one, but what is your question? Well, my question uh I I have several as you might imagine, but uh are you happy is the first one. And then for a leader, I think uh one of the things you have to do is sort of uh feel your uh environment and what you're doing and develop a big hairy audacious goal. Um you you I if if you're if you've got or a behag, right? If you've got a bee hag, then you're you're out on the horizon

[49:36]  and you're leading. If if all you know is operations, then you're probably just looking at your toes. Uh and and if you're a chief operating officer, that's exactly what you ought to be doing. Uh but if you're uh if you're the CEO and the the the vision of your organization, your eyes need to be on the horizon for uh adverse things coming, for opportunities, uh for development, for a B h a G big hairy audacious goal.

[50:10]  Toeer, thank you so much for your time here guys. If you guys are still watching, make sure that you guys do like, subscribe, and comment. This has been an amazing conversation with another leader and congrats on all the years of success. I know success doesn't always look pretty, but you've made it to the other side where you're now retiring. Congratulations for all the work you've done in your community. Um, and really touching others. A lot of times you do things and you don't even kind of get it back and that's not what we do it for. So, I can imagine there's a lot of people that just kind of thank you and I would just say thank you on on their behalf. But we appreciate you here on the Heart and Hustle podcast as well.

[50:42]  You're a champ, man. Thank you for that. And I just want you to know I'm trying to look pretty. Guys, thank you guys so much. It's been the Heart Hustle podcast. Ephrain Topher. We'll catch you guys on the next one. Bye. Backs.